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markwsmith

The Reformation?

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Men came out of the RCC -- Martin Luther was one of them. Some of the monks realized that some of what the RCC taught was not Scriptural -- they tried to reform the church from within, but couldn't. So we've got the Lutheran, Presbyterian, Methodist churches and the Baptist came along after a while. And there's also John Calvin and Armenianism. Except I can't remember Mr. Armenias' first name.

 

Protestantism was a result of the Reformation.

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And here's my favorite quote by Arminius:

Next to the study of the Scriptures which I earnestly inculcate, I exhort my pupils to peruse Calvin's Commentaries, which I extol in loftier terms than Helmich himself [a Dutch divine, 1551-1608]; for I affirm that he excels beyond comparison (incomparabilem esse) in the interpretation of Scripture, and that his commentaries ought to be more highly valued than all that is handed down to us by the library of the fathers; so that I acknowledge him to have possessed above most others, or rather above all other men, what may be called an eminent spirit of prophecy (spiritum aliquem prophetiae eximium). ~Jacobus Arminius

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Ah, yes, Jacob Arminius - thank you.

 

Hi Sue, no problem. Being a Calvinist, I have come across that name pretty often in my studies and in my discussions over the last 30 years.

 

--David

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Then you must these are false churches built by men! For Jesus Christ said "l will build My church ( singular or one true church) Peter and the Apostles, with power and authority!" Matt 16:18 John 20:21 Eph 2:20 the so called reformers were NOT Apostles!

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How can you believe in the Reformation when the church was not reformed but new churches, (if that's even possible) were created?

 

You need to consider what the word "church" means. It is a body of people who are called out of a larger group for a special purpose. It can mean the universal church, which is made up of all believers, or it can mean a local church, all of the believers in a certain geographical area. It was intended to reform the universal church and to some extent it succeeded because many Catholics believed the gospel and were saved. Many of them had to leave the Catholic church so they gathered together to form new local churches where they could meet together for teaching and fellowship.

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How can there be more than one true church, are there more than one God, kingdom, new covenant, household of faith, vineyard, no! But theres thousands of church's, all founded by men and false churches not built by Christ on Peter and the Apostles! The church must be universal also, John 3:16 the whole world!

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There is one true church made up of all who are true believers in Christ. There are many local churches made up of a group of believers living in a specific locality. The New Testament includes letters that Paul wrote to churches in Rome, Corinth, Galatia, Ephesus, Colossae, and Thessalonica. In addition there are groups of local churches who share the same belief that are associated in organizations that call themselves churches, such as the Catholic church or the Anglican church. Local churches include members who are born again and are members of the true church and also some who profess to be Christians but are not really members of the true church.

 

Do you attend a church anywhere? Being involved in a local church might help you understand what the Bible is talking about when it speaks of churches.

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There can only be one church as Christ said I will build My church! There can only be one body of Christ! Not some spiritual gathering of believers! But the one true church ( physical) you are a holy nation etc. 1 Pet 2:9

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There is only one true body but the members of that body are spread out through all of the world so they can't all meet together in one place. That is why we have local churches.

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Yes bit each local church must be united to Christ by the Apostles! The reformers and their false doctrines and church are not built by Christ on Peter and the Apostles, there is only one new and eternal covenant with Christ as the mediator! One true church!

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Yes bit each local church must be united to Christ by the Apostles!

 

Each church must be united to Christ but it is the Holy Spirit, not the apostles, who forms this union.

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Yes bit each local church must be united to Christ by the Apostles! The reformers and their false doctrines and church are not built by Christ on Peter and the Apostles, there is only one new and eternal covenant with Christ as the mediator! One true church!
Yeah I know what you mean. All those false doctrines like reading the Bible for yourself in your native language, believing that the righteous should live by faith, and that salvation is not by works. What were they thinking?!?!?!? THEY MUST HAVE BEEN CRAZY.
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The reformers actually reinstated the Church that Christ built though the apostles. Now it seems you're trying to say that the church was built on the apostle Peter as the first Pope, yet Peter never acted as Pope. Nor would Peter allow anyone to bow down to him as the Pope does. Peter is not the rock on which Christ builds His church, the God revealed knowledge that Jesus is the Son of God is the rock.

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Actually the word church itself is part of the problem. The word is better translated as Tyndale originally did and the early Geneva Bible did also as congregation. The NT was written to congregations. Christ found not the congregation on Peter or the Apostles but on himself and Peter's testimony that Jesus is the Christ. For no other foundation can anyone lay than that which is laid,which is Jesus Christ.

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I belong to The Church of Peter! Peter ate fish and he ate bread. He also drank wine. The bible never says he ate or drank anything else so anyone who eats beef, or lamb, or pork, or mutton, or chicken, or turkey, or bison, or eels, or eats potatoes, or vegatables, or fruit, or salads; or drinks water, or 7UP or Pepsi, or Coca Cola or beer, or lemonade or ice tea is wrong and will go to hell!!! :-)

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And here's my favorite quote by Arminius

I have spent time studying both Calvinism and Arminianism. as much as I strongly agree with Calvinism I struggle with free will. Why give any invitation when those who will be saved will eventually come to know Him?

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Staff
I belong to The Church of Peter! Peter ate fish and he ate bread. He also drank wine. The bible never says he ate or drank anything else so anyone who eats beef, or lamb, or pork, or mutton, or chicken, or turkey, or bison, or eels, or eats potatoes, or vegatables, or fruit, or salads; or drinks water, or 7UP or Pepsi, or Coca Cola or beer, or lemonade or ice tea is wrong and will go to hell!!! :-)

You're a hoot!

 

God bless,

William

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And here's my favorite quote by Arminius

I have spent time studying both Calvinism and Arminianism. as much as I strongly agree with Calvinism I struggle with free will. Why give any invitation when those who will be saved will eventually come to know Him?

Those who reject Christ are accountable because they have the freewill to do so. But they can't accept the invention because the freewill is in bondage to the sinful nature. In other words, mans sin has ruined his ability to will what is right.

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    • 7 Reasons Pastors (Still) Need the Reformation

      Twenty years ago, Reformed theology made landfall on the shores of my life with the force of a Category 5 hurricane. I’d been in ministry only a few months and preached only a few times when God put a few men in my path who gently and patiently guided me toward sound doctrine. They introduced me to Augustine and his Confessions, Luther and his Commentary on Galatians, Calvin and his Institutes, the five solas, TULIP, Bunyan and his Pilgrim’s Progress, Spurgeon and his steel backbone in the Downgrade Controversy, Lloyd-Jones and his Romans series. Consistent with the Reformed way, I hadn’t been looking for a Big God theology; it found me. And like the landscape after a massive hurricane, my mind and heart and ministry have never been the same. My pastoral ministry has been deeply shaped by the Reformation—its key figures, its theology, and those who have followed in its tradition such as the Puritans and my Particular Baptist fathers. Space and reader patience would fail me were I to list all the ways the Reformation has shaped me, but here are seven ways it has helped me and can help every pastor. 1. Regularly preaching the five solas means you’ll always be relevant. At its most fundamental level, the Reformation was a recovery of relevance because it was a recovery of the gospel. The gospel—preached from a framework of salvation by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone, as found in Scripture alone, for the glory of God alone—is relevant in every single age. And God’s Word is powerful “out of the box.” I don’t need to revise it, improve it, or update it. Scripture comes equipped with its own affirming power, and if I proclaim it faithfully to both the lost and the found, it will do its work through the Holy Spirit. Recovery of the gospel was at the heart of the Reformation, and keeping the gospel front and center will always be the heart of faithful gospel ministry. Michael Reeves said it well: “The Reformation was not principally a negative movement about moving away from Rome and its corruption; it was a positive movement, about moving toward the gospel.” In my exegesis, my exhortation, my application, and my own life and leadership in both home and church, I must always be moving toward the gospel. 2. You don’t have to search for a silver bullet for transformation. God has provided it.   The formal principle of the Reformation, sola Scriptura, is what helpless sinners need. How did Luther sum up his massive contribution as the unwitting founder of Protestantism? “I did nothing; the Word did everything.” Scripture provides us with an all-sufficient framework for worship, for discipleship, for evangelism, for counseling, for life. God has a people. He is sovereign. And so he will certainly save and sanctify sinners when we preach his Word. Yes, we must do evangelism and missions if we would obey Scripture. Yes, we must take the gospel to our neighborhood and the nations with compassion and zeal. But we must trust that the Spirit of God working through the Word of God is the power of God for salvation for everyone who believes. We press for repentance and faith, but the Word does everything in converting a sinner; we do nothing. 3. God has told you how to interpret his Word and how he expects to be worshiped. Jesus makes clear in Luke 24 that we are to interpret the Old Testament as finding its fulfillment in him. Thus, the New Testament writers show us how to interpret the Old in light of the person and work of Jesus. In his Institutes, Calvin identified the Reformed tradition’s bedrock method of interpreting and exegeting the sacred text: It follows that the Old Testament was established upon the free mercy of God, and was confirmed by Christ’s intercession. For the gospel preaching, too, declares nothing else than that sinners are justified apart from their own merit by God’s fatherly kindness; and the whole of it is summed up in Christ. Who, then, dares separate Jews from Christ, since with them, we hear, was made the covenant of the gospel, the sole foundation of which is Christ? Who dares to estrange from the gift of free salvation those to whom we hear the doctrine of the righteousness of faith was imparted? . . . If the Lord, in manifesting his Christ, discharged his ancient oath, one cannot but say the Old Testament always had its end in eternal life. Intrinsic to God’s Word is also a complementarity between law and gospel. The moral law of God as summarized in the Ten Commandments demonstrates God’s holy character, exposes man’s sin and need for a mediator, and provides a guide to sanctification. The law breaks; the gospel heals. The law says “run”; the gospel gives us legs. You need both to properly understand either. In addition to an inspired hermeneutic, God has given us a regulative principle for worship. He knows best how he is to be worshiped. The regulative principle is by no means a straightjacket, but opens the entire Bible to us. 4. Knowledge of both God and self line the path to genuine wisdom. Calvin’s opening words in the Institutes represent an accurate summary of biblical anthropology and theology—and are irreducible pillars for life and ministry. Only when I see myself as a great sinner and Christ as a great Savior does my thinking become rightly ordered. God is holy, I am not; I need, therefore, his purity and wisdom and power every moment as both a follower of Christ and also a leader in his church. This critical truth has profoundly shaped both my devotional life and also my preaching. Without true knowledge of God, there is no true knowledge of self. 5. You need living mentors. Being my own pastor has always felt a bit strained. Every pastor needs a pastor. Timothy had Paul, Augustine had Ambrose, Luther had Von Staupitz, Calvin had Bucer, Beza had Calvin, Whitefield and Wesley had each other, Sproul had Gerstner. I need at least one seasoned godly mentor, too—one able to guide, direct, chasten, and encourage me in the things of God, one positioned to keep a close watch on my life and doctrine (1 Tim. 4:16). 6. You need dead mentors. As is often said, we stand on the shoulders of giants. We were not the first to tread this territory, and we won’t be the last. Therefore, we need the insights of Scripture-saturated, God-entranced church leaders from the past to help affirm and amend our interpretation and application of Scripture. While history does not play a magisterial role for us, it can and should play a ministerial role in our lives and ministries through the figures and doctrines from our rich evangelical heritage. So not only do I need a living mentor, I also need heroes from the past. And these men and women come with one benefit that living heroes don’t: the final chapter of their lives has been written. We know how they turned out. Though they are deeply flawed like our living mentors, neither Twitter, Facebook, nor lurid corners of the internet will suddenly topple their ministries. 7. Reformation continues until Jesus returns. The battle for the Bible wasn’t over when Protestantism germinated and blossomed in Luther’s train. It wasn’t over in the Southern Baptist Convention when key offices at last bulged with conservative evangelicals. It wasn’t over when conservative Presbyterians split from moderates. And it’s not over in local churches today. Our cry will always be semper reformanda—reformed, and always reforming (according to Scripture). Our hearts are prone to wander from orthodoxy; in every age, therefore, we must reaffirm and guard our confessional integrity and our submission to God’s Word. I’m not as young or restless as when this journey in grace began, but I will always be reforming—in my heart, in my family, and in my congregation. Praise God that it pleased him to work through flawed, ordinary men like Luther and Calvin to unleash afresh an extraordinary gospel. Every evangelical, no matter his or her denomination, is deeply indebted to the reformers and those who courageously followed in their wake. Until Christ returns, may God continue building his church through the sin-killing, life-transforming gospel, recovered in the Reformation, which is none other than the gospel of the Lord Jesus. View the full article

      in Christian Current Events

    • Reformation Sale on Video, eBooks, and Online Courses from Zondervan

      Without books there would have been no Reformation. Still today, 501 years since Martin Luther posted his 95 Theses, we read and apply the biblical and theological insights of the Reformers. Time marches on, but we do not move on from the Word of God they loved, taught, and defended. We continue the work of reformation today in the hopes that our ministry practices and personal decisions may conform to the character and command of God. And books still aid in the reform, even as the technology evolves. Once again our friends at Zondervan Academic have launched a sale on works by Reformed thinkers that runs from October 24 to November 1. But for the first time this Reformation sale includes deals on video lectures and online courses, in addition to the usual eBooks. These online courses pull together the video lecture and eBook content into a learning platform that offers additional functionality, such as interactive question-and-answer prompts. Check out the sale titles below, and find books and courses that will help you teach and life the timeless truth of the Reformed faith. 1. God’s Word Alone by Matthew Barrett    Video Lectures (12 Lessons)
      DVD  Sale: $25.00 Original: $49.99
      Streaming Sale: $19.99 Original: $39.99
      EBOOK Sale: $3.99 Original: $12.99 OR Online Course: coming soon!       2. Romans by Douglas J. Moo Video Lectures (49 Lessons)
      DVD Sale: $50.00 Original: $99.99
      Streaming Sale: $39.99 Original: $79.99
      EBOOK Sale: $4.99 Original: $23.99 OR Online Course
      Sale: $89.99 Original: $119.99
      (Online course contains the video lecture and eBook content, and more.)   3. Systematic Theology by Wayne Grudem Video Lectures (57 Lessons)
      DVD Sale: $25.00 Original: $49.99
      Streaming Sale: $19.99 Original: $39.99
      EBOOK Sale: $9.99 Original: $34.99 OR Online Course
      Sale: $161.24 Original: $214.99
      (Online course contains the video lecture and eBook content, and more.)   4. Church History, Volume Two by John Woodbridge and Frank James III Video Lectures (22 Lessons)
      DVD Sale: $25.00 Original: $49.99
      Streaming Sale: $19.99 Original: $39.99
      EBOOK Sale: $8.99 Original: $37.99 OR Online Course
      Sale: $89.99 Original: $119.99
      (Online course contains the video lecture and eBook content, and more.)   5. Apologetics at the Cross by Joshua Chatraw and Mark Allen Video Lectures (14 Lessons)
      DVD Sale: $20.00 Original: $39.99
      Streaming Sale: $15.99 Original: $31.99
      EBOOK Sale: $8.99 Original: $22.99 OR Online Course
      Sale: $89.99 Original: $119.99
      (Online course contains the video lecture and eBook content, and more.)   6. Historical Theology by Gregg Allison Video Lectures (33 Lessons)
      DVD Sale: $25.00 Original: $49.99
      Streaming Sale: $19.99 Original: $39.99
      EBOOK Sale: $7.99 Original: $29.99 OR Online Course
      Sale: $89.99 Original: $119.99
      (Online course contains the video lecture and eBook content, and more.)   7. Evangelism in a Skeptical World by Sam Chan Video Lectures (12 Lessons)
      DVD Sale: $15.00 Original: $29.99
      Streaming Sale: $11.99 Original: $23.99
      EBOOK Sale: $5.99 Original: $12.99 OR Online Course
      Sale: $89.99 Original: $119.99
      (Online course contains the video lecture and eBook content, and more.)     8. A Theology of Biblical Counseling by Heath Lambert Video Lectures (12 Lessons)
      DVD Sale: $20.00 Original: $39.99
      Streaming Sale: $15.99 Original: $31.99
      EBOOK Sale: $5.99 Original: $12.99 OR Online Course
      Sale: $89.99 Original: $119.99
      (Online course contains the video lecture and eBook content, and more.)     9. Galatians by Thomas Schreiner Video Lectures (26 Lessons)
      DVD Sale: $50.00 Original: $99.99
      Streaming Sale: $39.99 Original: $79.99
      EBOOK Sale: $4.99 Original: $24.99 OR Online Course
      Sale: $89.99 Original: $119.99
      (Online course contains the video lecture and eBook content, and more.)   10. Know Why You Believe by K. Scott Oliphint Video Lectures (12 Lessons)
      DVD Sale: $15.00 Original: $29.99
      Streaming Sale: $11.99 Original: $23.99
      EBOOK Sale: $3.99 Original: $9.99 OR Online Course
      Sale: $89.99 Original: $119.99
      (Online course contains the video lecture and eBook content, and more.)     11. Know How We Got Our Bible by Ryan Reeves and Charles Hill Video Lectures (13 Lessons)
      DVD Sale: $15.00 Original: $29.99
      Streaming Sale: $11.99 Original: $23.99
      EBOOK Sale: $3.99 Original: $9.99 OR Online Course: coming soon!         12. Know the Creeds and Councils by Justin Holcomb Video Lectures (15 Lessons)
      DVD Sale: $15.00 Original: $29.99
      Streaming Sale: $11.99 Original: $23.99
      EBOOK Sale: $2.99 Original: $9.99 OR Online Course
      Sale: $89.99 Original: $119.99
      (Online course contains the video lecture and eBook content, and more.)   EBOOK SALE 13. Rediscovering the Holy Spirit by Michael Horton Sale: $5.99 Original: $12.99 14. Gaining by Losing by J. D. Greear Sale: $2.99 Original: $9.99 15. Scripture and Counseling edited by Bob Kellemen Sale: $6.99 Original: $21.99 16. The Gagging of God by D. A. Carson Sale: $3.99 Original: $20.99 17. Next Story by Tim Challies Sale: $2.99 Original: $6.99 18. Shaped by the Gospel by Timothy Keller Sale: $2.99 Original: $6.99 19. What’s Best Next by Matt Perman Sale: $2.99 Original: $14.99 20. Comfort the Grieving by Paul Tautges Sale: $1.99 Original: $7.49 View the full article

      in Christian Current Events

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