Jump to content

The Protestant Community

Christian and Theologically Protestant? Or, sincerely inquiring about the Protestant faith? Welcome to Christforums the Christian Protestant community. You'll first need to register in order to join our community. Create or respond to threads on your favorite topics and subjects. Registration takes less than a minute, it's simple, fast, and free! Enjoy the fellowship! God bless, Christforums' Staff
Register now

Fenced Community

Christforums is a Protestant Christian forum, open to Bible-believing Christians such as Presbyterians, Lutherans, Reformed, Baptists, Church of Christ members, Pentecostals, Anglicans. Methodists, Charismatics, or any other conservative, Nicene- derived Christian Church. We do not solicit cultists of any kind, including Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, Eastern Lightning, Falun Gong, Unification Church, Aum Shinrikyo, Christian Scientists or any other non-Nicene, non-Biblical heresy.
Register now

Christian Fellowship

John Calvin puts forward a very simple reason why love is the greatest gift: “Because faith and hope are our own: love is diffused among others.” In other words, faith and hope benefit the possessor, but love always benefits another. In John 13:34–35 Jesus says, “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.” Love always requires an “other” as an object; love cannot remain within itself, and that is part of what makes love the greatest gift.
Sign in to follow this  

Death Wish

Recommended Posts

There is never a chastising or discipline of God with those in Christ that results in punishment (Heb 12:5-9, chiefly 10, 11), difficulty usually but never from being in trouble with Him or losing His favor with you who are in Christ. The Spirit’s opposition to our “sinful nature” (Gal 5:17) may at times feel to us that God is against us personally but we are to remember that this address is always against the “old man,” to keep us from doing that which we would otherwise be doing in accordance to our old man.


In my assessment, the believer’s doing of God’s “pleasure” (Phil 2:13) is contained in the desire He “works” in us, which to put His desires first. Even though there will always be times of doing “the evil that I desire not” (Rom 7), the issue is that the believer in the new nature does not desire it, thus any wrongfulness done is unintentional because it’s being done against the will and desire of the believer, e.g. as a “captive” (vs 23) or unwilling subject, unlike that of a willing subject, who does not act as a captive to it because it’s his desire and thus not against his will.


Since He ensures that our ultimate motives are always “His good pleasure,” there leaves only that which is of our Father’s loving-training school, and since He already knows what all will do in every situation it is always for others to learn from concerning every trialing situation. In Job’s case (and all who are in Christ) He knew he would manifest an overall acceptable representation of Him (33:10), thus discrediting Satan’s claims against Job, which also demonstrates God’s antecedent preparation of Job’s life to learn from it.


This is the same care and outcome God maintains for all who are His in Christ. One evidence manifesting our learning here is that we will find ourselves wishing we would learn to take each difficulty (general hardness) with less surprise and hardness, so that we might strengthen and manifest our faith more in remembering to take them lighter via by the forethought of knowing God has already “worked” it out for our “good” (Rom 8:28). Being mindful, that antecedent to every trial small or great, God has beforehand prepared us not only to “endure” it (1 Cor 10:13), but more importantly to learn from it unto the strengthening of our faith (1 Pet 1:7) in our Father and our Lord Jesus.


“We give great honor to those who endure under suffering. For instance, you know about Job, a man of great endurance. You can see how the Lord was kind to him at the end, for the Lord is full of tenderness and mercy” (Jam 5:11 NLT).


- NC



Death Wish


It should be borne in mind that, while it is God’s purpose in His dealings with Job to vindicate His own estimate of His servant, it is at the same time, shown us how He educates or disciplines that servant so as to render him worthy of this estimate.


“That which I feared greatly has come upon me.” This must ever be the case when the soul has no better security for the love than the evidence and presence of its gifts. The gifts are thus a snare to us, and Satan’s imputation against us is often in a measure true; our ground of rest and quietness of spirit before our Father being His kindness and mercies to us, and not simply the knowledge of His love to us in His Son. This is very evident from the grief and despair many of His people fall into when they are deprived of any particular mercy. They had rested in the gift more than in the Father, and the gift was to them an evidence of His love; the love itself was not the rest of their heart.


Job’s discipline is administered in order to set aside self, and introduce the heart into its true relation, with self apart from God. Hence the effect of the discipline is to expose the secret workings and feelings of the old man, which otherwise would not have been detected or known, and, if not known, not renounced. Job felt himself now a hapless one, with misery all around him, having outlived every enjoyment on earth, and he cursed his day. What had he lived for, and what should he live for?


Little he knew the place he was occupying before God, or how God was preparing him, through terrible sufferings, to vindicate His own estimate of him to Satan—and ultimately, to ourselves. We have now to examine how God effects this, His blessed purpose, noting the course which a soul under discipline from the Father necessarily takes in order to arrive at simple dependence and rest in Him.


The first thought, and the bitterest one, after awakening to a full sense of one’s misery, is to curse one’s day; a terrible impression, and one that can lead to suicide when God is not known. But when the Father is known, as in Job’s case, it is the beginning of healthy action, not in the discontent and wretchedness which it discloses, but because the sense of death, utter exclusion from everything is known and felt. I may give way to rebellion and discontent in learning the utter wretchedness of man on earth, but the sense of this is necessary to full self-renunciation.


I ought not to blame my Father for it, but I need to realize it as man’s true place (actual condition without God—NC). Death, because of such present misery, is preferred. To live in it has no attraction for the heart. This Job feels. He knows that God seeks to make him a witness of dependence upon Himself against Satan, yes, and himself (e.g. old self or sinful nature—NC). But this is the Father’s way. Discipline may have the effect of making us feel that death is preferable to life, but it is working out the Father’s purposes on our behalf.


Job knew that he had done nothing to deserve his trial; but what he had to learn was that he was entitled to nothing. We are not aware often of the severe process of soul which we must pass through before we are prepared to hear of the Father from His own side. We may have to weary ourselves in very darkness before we are ready to hear the word of light; for light come from the Father only: He (the Lord Jesus) is the “light which lights everyone which comes into the world.”


- J B Stoney




MJS devotional for Feb. 7: http://www.abideabove.com/hungry-heart/


Devotional excerpt: “It is only natural to feel that our need requires immediate victory, but the truth is that we cannot come to maturity apart from the Holy Spirit’s processing and development of our life, day by day. A quick and easy victory would cripple our usefulness in these two ways: we would not understand the all-important principle of processing; we would not appreciate the needs of others. If we are unable to share, we abide alone like the grain of wheat that does not die.”


Share this post

Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Similar Topics

    • Jerry Brown says officer's death not related to Sanctuary City

      It is beyond me how someone can be so idiotic and depraved. And it is beyond me how voters can be represented by someone unless they themselves are truly being represented accurately. Jerry Brown suggests that before the laws surrounding whether local law enforcement could not coordinate, communicate, and work with ICE had gone into effect that ICE could have prevented the officer's murder by an illegal immigrant. Well Jerry, guess your laws will be an obstacle now towards any future prevention of unnecessary murders!   The left suggests that we should not be divided by political lines. Yet what previous Democrats believed on border security no longer fits the left's narrative today. The left is so politically bent and motivated that regardless of what is common sense, moral, or correct automatically is opposed. The left is an opposition that has no other platform other than to oppose the Right.   Jerry Brown: Death of police officer Ronil Singh 'had nothing to do' with California's 'sanctuary' status WWW.WASHINGTONEXAMINER.COM Outgoing California Gov. Jerry Brown said the death of police officer Ronil Singh has "nothing" to do with the state's "sanctuary" status.  

      in Political Conservative News

    • My rather grisly take on the death of JonBenet.

      JonBenet Ramsay died at the age of six during the night following Christmas Day 1996.  Her body was found in the basement of her family home in Boulder the following day.  A lengthy ransom note was found in the house a few hours earlier.   Suspicion soon fell on her family, partly because of their untypical behaviour, and partly because of a lack of evidence for any break-in to the house.  It has been suggested that either a parent or her 9yo brother killed her - probably not intentionally - and that her murder was then staged as a cover-up.   The problems with this include the lack of evidence for any family member killing her, and the fact that in 2003 the DNA of an unknown male was found on the clothes worn by JonBenet at the murder scene.  Also, the ransom note - although written on paper owned by JonBenet's mother with one of her pens - was not identified with the handwriting of any family member.  Nor were any fingerprints found on it.   The Boulder police are still working on the intruder theory, but there are problems with that as well.  The supposed entry window had undisturbed cobwebs, and it is hard to see how an intruder would waste time writing a lengthy ransom note before vanishing without trace.   Having considered the evidence, I have reached the rather scary conclusion that JonBenet was sodomised and then murdered by a man who was allowed into the house by a member of the family - quite possibly with the intention of letting him abuse her.  It seems to tick almost every box.   The only box it perhaps does not tick is that a neighbour heard a child scream at around 5am (I think), followed by a sound consistent with someone leaving a house but not by the front door.   JonBenet's father and brother are both still alive, and can now sue me for libel.  

      in Off Topic Discussion

    • Christian Loves His Enemies, Also Wishes Swift Death Upon Ruth Bader Ginsburg

      KENNESAW, GA—Local Christian man Ronald Mackey always makes it a point in his Christian walk to show the love of Jesus even to people who disagree with him. The post Christian Loves His Enemies, Also Wishes Swift Death Upon Ruth Bader Ginsburg appeared first on The Babylon Bee. View the original full article

      in Christian Satire

    • Guatemalan Migrant Father Declined Medical Treatment For Sick Child Before Death

      By Joe Simonson - The father of the Guatemalan child who died in a U.S. government holding facility on Christmas Day denied further medical treatment from U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CPB) agents after the child vomited following an initial examination from doctors, a spokesman from the Department of Homeland security said on a call to reporters Wednesday. Government officials provided further details, including the startling disclosure of the father’s behavior, regarding the timeline of the child’s deteriorating condition. According to officials, the eight-year-old boy, who has not been named, was given multiple medical examinations by doctors before being released with prescription medications. Following the child’s first discharge from the hospital, both he and the father were put into a temporary holding facility where agents were aware of the child’s illness and provided the child with his medication. A few hours after the father and boy entered the facility, the child complained of being nauseous and later vomited. It was at this point that the father declined further medical treatment for his son and told officials that he “had been feeling better,” an official said. During a subsequent welfare check, agents at the facility noticed the child’s condition and transported him to the hospital. The child later lost consciousness during transit and shortly after was declared dead. Government officials did not comment on why exactly they think the father denied further treatment for his child, despite him exhibiting more severe symptoms. Content created by The Daily Caller News Foundation is available without charge to any eligible news publisher that can provide a large audience. For licensing opportunities of our original content, please contact [email protected] Guatemalan Migrant Father Declined Medical Treatment For Sick Child Before Death is original content from Conservative Daily News - Where Americans go for news, current events and commentary they can trust - Conservative News Website for U.S. News, Political Cartoons and more. View the original full article

      in Political Conservative News

    • Otto Warmbier’s Family Wants $1 Billion From North Korea Over Son’s Death

      By Neetu Chandak - The family of Otto Warmbier wants $1 billion in damages from North Korea over their son’s death, according to a testimony Wednesday. Warmbier was a University of Virginia student who allegedly stole a propaganda poster while touring the country in January 2016. The student was convicted and sentenced to 15 years of hard labor by the state for the alleged crime in March 2016. He was released with the help of U.S. President Donald Trump in June 2017, but Otto died a week after his return in the University of Cincinnati Medical Center in Ohio. Those seeking repayment for the damages from the Democratic People’s Republic of Korea include parents Fred and Cindy Warmbier along with Otto Warmbier’s estate, The Washington Post reported Wednesday. “We’re here because we don’t fear North Korea anymore,” Fred Warmbier said, according to WaPo. The testimony took place in front of Chief Judge Beryl A. Howell of the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia, WaPo reported. The Warmbiers said they wanted the judge to hold North Korea accountable for holding hostage, torturing and killing Otto Warmbier. “We are not going to be the victims,” Cindy Warmbier said, according to The Hill. “I want them [North Korea] to feel victimized.” The Warmbiers are also asking for $46 million to make up for the family’s suffering, The Hill reported. Hamilton County, Ohio, coroner Lakshmi Sammarco said Otto Warmbier died from brain damage due to lack of oxygen and blood, NPR reported. North Korea has repeatedly denied torturing Otto Warmbier, claiming the student developed a rare form of food poisoning called botulism and went into a coma after ingesting a sleeping pill. Medical officials, however, did not find any proof to support the country’s claim. Medical personnel also did not find signs of physical abuse like abnormal scars or bone fractures. Experts who testified Wednesday said many methods of torture in North Korea do not leave a trace, WaPo reported. They added that Otto Warmbier could have been abused for political purposes. Otto Warmbier’s parents claimed their son returned to the U.S. blind and deaf. Fred Warmbier added that his son’s teeth looked like they were rearranged with pliers. Fred and Cindy Warmbier first filed the lawsuit against North Korea on April 26. Content created by The Daily Caller News Foundation is available without charge to any eligible news publisher that can provide a large audience. For licensing opportunities of our original content, please contact [email protected] Otto Warmbier’s Family Wants $1 Billion From North Korea Over Son’s Death is original content from Conservative Daily News - Where Americans go for news, current events and commentary they can trust - Conservative News Website for U.S. News, Political Cartoons and more. View the original full article

      in Political Conservative News


Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.