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Jedothek

Who begot Jesus?

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Christian literature says both that the Holy Spirit begot Jesus and that the Father begot him. Perhaps they cooperated in some way. Would anyone care to comment?

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1 hour ago, Jedothek said:

Christian literature says both that the Holy Spirit begot Jesus and that the Father begot him. Perhaps they cooperated in some way. Would anyone care to comment?

You have to be more specific.  Which Christian literature?

 

The N.T. does not claim that Jesus was begotten by the Holy Spirit.  However it does claim that Jesus was conceived by\because of the Holy Spirit.

 

"she was found to be with child from the Holy Spirit." (Matt. 1:18)

 

"for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Spirit." (Matt. 1:20)

 

 

This is very much in keeping with the Creeds.

 

"Who was born of the Holy Spirit and the Virgin Mary" (Old Roman Creed)

 

"who was conceived by the Holy Spirit" (Apostles' Creed)

 

 "and was incarnate by the Holy Ghost and of the Virgin Mary, and was made man" (Niceno-Constantinopolitan Creed, A.D. 381)

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Matthew says that Mary was pregnant and Jesus was conceived ek pneumatos hagiou , which means out of holy spirit. Ek also means   from,  because of,  of and by. 

 If this means something other than conventional begetting, please explain what that is. 


Your citations of the Creeds is extremely selective.  We also have 

 

                We believe in... one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the Only-begotten, Begotten of the Father       
                    (The Nicene-Constantinopolitan Creed , AD 381 )
 

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On 7/28/2018 at 1:01 PM, Jedothek said:

Matthew says that Mary was pregnant and Jesus was conceived ek pneumatos hagiou , which means out of holy spirit. Ek also means   from,  because of,  of and by. 

 If this means something other than conventional begetting, please explain what that is. 


Your citations of the Creeds is extremely selective.  We also have 

 

                We believe in... one Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of God, the Only-begotten, Begotten of the Father       
                    (The Nicene-Constantinopolitan Creed , AD 381 )
 

I pointed all of that out in an above post.  You have not cited anything that supports your claim concerning the Holy Spirit.

 

You said: "Christian literature says both that the Holy Spirit begot Jesus..."

 

Neither the Creeds nor the N.T. state that the Holy Spirit begot Jesus.

 

The N.T. does claim that Jesus was conceived by the Holy Spirit as I also pointed out above.

 

Quote

Your citations of the Creeds is extremely selective.

Not at all.  The Nicene Creed of A.D.  325 nor Old Roman Creed says anything about the Holy Spirit begetting Jesus.

 

I also cited Nicene-Constantinopolitan Creed (A.D. 381) and that Creed does not claim that Jesus was begotten by the Holy Spirit.

 

Now both the N.T. and the Creeds do claim that Jesus was begotten by God the Father but they NEVER state Jesus was begotten by the Holy Spirit.

 

Again I ask which Christian literature claim that Jesus was begotten by the Holy Spirit?

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3 hours ago, Jedothek said:

Perhaps they cooperated in some way.

1. All three Persons of the Trinity were involved in the incarnation of Christ.

a. The Father (Hebrews 10:5)

b. The Lord Jesus (Philippians 2:7; Hebrews 2:14)

c. The Holy Spirit (Luke 1:35)

 

2. All three Persons of the Trinity were involved in the resurrection of Christ.

a. The Father (Galatians 1:1)

b. The Lord Jesus (John 2:19-21; 10:18)

c. The Holy Spirit (Romans 8:11)

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Origen, I called your use of the creeds selective because you quoted the part of the Niceno-Constantinopolitan Creed of 381 that says that Jesus was incarnate by the Holy Ghost but omitted the part which says that he was begotten of the Father, when my point was that Christian literature makes both claims. Now my question to you , which I must repeat since you have not answered it, remains: if to say that Jesus was conceived out of holy spirit does not mean that the Holy spirit begot Jesus, then what DOES it mean? (I’m not trying to shout with those full caps, it’s just for emphasis.)      
 

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On 7/28/2018 at 7:22 PM, Jedothek said:

Origen, I called your use of the creeds selective because you quoted the part of the Niceno-Constantinopolitan Creed of 381 that says that Jesus was incarnate by the Holy Ghost but omitted the part which says that he was begotten of the Father

Why would I cite that section?  I did not deny the Creeds states that Jesus was begotten by the God the Father.  That point was never in question, never an issue so there was no reason for me to cite or address it.  That would have been pointless.  Again I want to know where in the Christian literature does it claim that Jesus was begotten by the Holy Spirit?

 

On 7/28/2018 at 7:22 PM, Jedothek said:

Now my question to you ,

You still have not answered mine.   I want to know where in Christian literature does it claim that Jesus was begotten by the Holy Spirit?  You still have not answer that question.  Yes the Creeds and the N.T. state that Jesus was conceived by\from the Holy Spirit.

 

On 7/28/2018 at 7:22 PM, Jedothek said:

if to say Jesus was conceived out of holy spirit does not mean that the Holy spirit begot Jesus, then what DOES it mean?

It is not incumbent upon me to prove anything one way or the other.  I simply asked a question.   I wanted documented evidence for your claim that "Christian literature says both that the Holy Spirit begot Jesus...".  Since you have not cited one I can only conclude you do not know of any.  Thus this thread has been nothing more than a complete waste of time.

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You've missed my point. I'm not claiming that Christian literature uses the word 'begotten' or a Greek equivalent  such as gennethenta anywhere with the agent named as holy spirit. I am asking what is the DIFFERENCE  between saying  "A was conceived out of B" and "B begot A" ; and in general, what does "A was conceived out of B"   MEAN?   

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16 minutes ago, Jedothek said:

You've missed my point. I'm not claiming that Christian literature uses the word 'begotten' or a Greek equivalent  such as gennethenta anywhere with the agent named as holy spirit. I am asking what is the DIFFERENCE  between saying  "A was conceived out of B" and "B begot A" ; and in general, what does "A was conceived out of B"   MEAN?   

No I did not miss your point.  That was your claim from the OP "Christian literature says both that the Holy Spirit begot Jesus...").  If you did not mean "Christian literature says," then you should not have written those words.  You should have been more precise with your claim.  Hence your original claim was in fact false given you have seemingly clarified (i.e. changed) your claim.

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I did not place quotes around ‘begot’ in the OP. My issue was not about vocabulary. I referred to holy spirit begetting Jesus because I do not see the difference between      "A was conceived out of B" and "B begot A". I have asked you to explain that difference.  You have not done so.         

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42 minutes ago, Jedothek said:

I did not place quotes around ‘begot’ in the OP. My issue was not about vocabulary. I referred to holy spirit begetting Jesus because I do not see the difference between      "A was conceived out of B" and "B begot A". I have asked you to explain that difference.  You have not done so.         

You did not place quotes around "begot."  Nevertheless your original meaning was clear (i.e. "Christian literature says both that the Holy Spirit begot Jesus...").  If you did not mean "Christian literature says," then you should not have written those words.   It was only after three posts that you at last clarified (i.e. changed) your claim.

 

42 minutes ago, Jedothek said:

I have asked you to explain that difference.  You have not done so.       

Is not incumbent upon me to prove anything one way or the other.  I have no obligating to explain anything which I have not claimed.  It is your burden to support your claim.  Given the fact you could not cite any documented sources for your original claim, and the fact that you have changed your claim, it is very doubtful.

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Much time could have been saved if you had said, “ I do not know the difference between ‘was conceived out of’ and ‘was begotten by.’ ” There is no shame in not knowing. In the  meantime, other readers of this thread, if such there be, might attempt to answer the question.
 

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9 hours ago, Jedothek said:

Much time could have been saved if you had said, “ I do not know the difference between ‘was conceived out of’ and ‘was begotten by.’ ”

First, the same could definitely said of you when the very first thing I said in my very first post was "You have to be more specific.  Which Christian literature?"

 

Second, you ought to take your own advice on the matter and just admit your original claim was false and there is no evidence to support it and that is why you changed it.  If only you had admitted your claim was false way back in your second post, then we would not be here.

 

Third, there is no reason for me to admit anything since I did not make any claim one way or the other.  Thus this point, like your original claim, fails.

 

9 hours ago, Jedothek said:

There is no shame in not knowing.

lol  Don't make it about me simply because you have failed to support your original claim.  If that is all you have, then you have nothing.

 

9 hours ago, Jedothek said:

In the  meantime, other readers of this thread, if such there be, might attempt to answer the question.

Oh you mean that so-called question where you changed your claim when you could not support it with Christian literature.

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So many folks will try to cause doubt in so many ways . To me the funny part is them thinking they have a 'new trick' . When that trick is the first one recorded. 

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15 minutes ago, Becky said:

So many folks will try to cause doubt in so many ways . To me the funny part is them thinking they have a 'new trick' . When that trick is the first one recorded. 

Exactly!

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I am always suspicious when anyone registers on this site and immediately starts a thread about the Trinity and/or the Deity of Christ and cast doubt on it.

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This is a "Christian Discussion" forum and it certainly would be more interesting if people ask and answer questions to facilitate that discussion.  If a question or response is not understood the best thing is to ask for clarification.  So far it seems all that has happened is the cat chasing its tail.  I, for one, would have difficulty is explaining the difference between 'begot'  and 'conceived' though I believe I grasp the difference.  Anyone care to give their explanation?

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1 hour ago, Civilwarbuff said:

This is a "Christian Discussion" forum and it certainly would be more interesting if people ask and answer questions to facilitate that discussion.  If a question or response is not understood the best thing is to ask for clarification.  So far it seems all that has happened is the cat chasing its tail.  I, for one, would have difficulty is explaining the difference between 'begot'  and 'conceived' though I believe I grasp the difference.  Anyone care to give their explanation?

You mean like this which can be found in my very first post.

23 hours ago, Origen said:

You have to be more specific.  Which Christian literature?

 

Or maybe when I asked in my second and third posts.

21 hours ago, Origen said:

Again I ask which Christian literature claim that Jesus was begotten by the Holy Spirit?

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37 minutes ago, Faber said:

I am always suspicious when anyone registers on this site and immediately starts a thread about the Trinity and/or the Deity of Christ and cast doubt on it.

Agreed!

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1 hour ago, Faber said:

I am always suspicious when anyone registers on this site and immediately starts a thread about the Trinity and/or the Deity of Christ and cast doubt on it.

I can appreciate that perspective but I don't feel this person falls into that category; it appears that maybe he is confused believing or thinking that 'begotten' and 'conceived' are synonymous.  But like Origen I too would be interested in what Christian literature supports his OP.

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This is why I think it is important for new members to introduce themselves at the "Welcome Mat". Notice what it says:

 

 "We encourage new members to post a short introduction of themselves in this Christian forum category. Get to know each other and share your common interests or tell us what church you go to etc."

https://www.christforums.org/forums/forum/3-welcome-mat/

 

I know I did the same way back when:

https://www.christforums.org/forums/topic/4098-first-day-freshman/

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Exactly @Faber

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1 hour ago, Faber said:

This is why I think it is important for new members to introduce themselves at the "Welcome Mat".

I could not agree more.  The truth is we simply have no way of knowing who is being sincere and who is not, who is honestly seeking answers and who desire to sow discord.


Like you Faber I also introduced myself.

 

Everyone notice when asked specific questions by William I did not beat around the bush, hem and haw, or avoid trying to answer.  I just answered the questions, and I even took the time to explain why I chose the name Origen.

 

 

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BEGOTTEN (G3439):

μονογενής monogenḗs, mon-og-en-ace'; from G3441 and G1096; only-born, i.e. sole:—only (begotten, child).

 

Thayer’s Greek Lexicon

μονογενής, μονογενές (μόνος and γένος) (Cicero,unigena; Vulg. (in Lukeunicus, elsewhere) and in ecclesiastical writingsunigenitus), single of its kind, only (A. V.only-begotten); used of only sons or daughters (viewed in relation to their parents), Hesiod theog. 426, 448; Herodotus 7, 221; Plato, Critias 113 d.; Josephus, Antiquities 1, 13, 1; 2, 7, 4; μονογενές τέκνον πατρί, Aeschylus Ag. 898. So in the Scriptures: Hebrews 11:17; μονογενῆ εἶναι τίνι (to be one's only son or daughter), Judges 11:34; Tobit 3:15; Luke 7:12; Luke 8:42; Luke 9:38; (cf. Westcott on Epistles of John, pp. 162ff). Hence, the expression ὁ μονογενής υἱός τοῦ Θεοῦ and υἱός τοῦ Θεοῦ ὁ μονογονης, John 3:16, 18; John 1:18 (see below); 1 John 4:9; μονογενής παρά πατρός, John 1:14 (some take this generally, owing to the omission of the article (cf. Green, pp. 48f)), used of Christ, denotes the only son of God or one who in the sense in which he himself is the son of God has no brethren. He is so spoken of by John not because ὁ λόγος which was ἐνσαρκωθεις in him was eternally generated by God the Father (the orthodox interpretation), or came forth from the being of God just before the beginning of the world (Subordinationism), but because by the incarnation (ἐνσαρκωσις) of the λόγος in him he is of nature or essentially Son of God, and so in a very different sense from that in which men are made by him τέκνα τοῦ Θεοῦ (John 1:13). For since in the writings of John the title ὁ ἱυος τοῦ Θεοῦ is given only to the historic Christ so called, neither the Logos alone, nor Jesus alone, but ὁ λόγος ὁ ἐνσαρκωθεις or Jesus through the λόγοςunited with God, is ὁ μονογενής υἱός τοῦ Θεοῦ. The reading μονογενής Θεός(without the article before μονογενής) in John 1:18, — which is supported by no inconsiderable weight of ancient testimony, received into the text by Tregelles, and Westcott and Hort, defended with much learning by Dr. Hort ("On μονογενής Θεόςin Scripture and Tradition in his Two Dissertations" Camb. and Lond. 1876), and seems not improbable to Harnack (in the Theol. Lit.-Zeit. for 1876, p. 541ff) (and Weiss (in Meyer 6te Aufl. at the passage)), but is foreign to John's mode of thought and speech (John 3:16, 18; 1 John 4:9), dissonant and harsh — appears to owe its origin to a dogmatic zeal which broke out soon after the early days of the church; (see articles on the reading by Prof. Abbot in the Bib. Sacr. for Oct. 1861 and in the Unitarian Rev. for June 1875 (in the latter copious references to other discussions of the same passage are given); see also Prof. Drummond in the Theol. Rev. for Oct. 1871). Further, see Grimm, Exgt. Hdbch. on Sap., p. 152f; (Westcott as above).

 

found in:

[Luk 7:12 NASB] 12 Now as He approached the gate of the city, a dead man was being carried out, the only[G3439] son of his mother, and she was a widow; and a sizeable crowd from the city was with her.
[Luk 8:42 NASB] 42 for he had an only[G3439] daughter, about twelve years old, and she was dying. But as He went, the crowds were pressing against Him.
[Luk 9:38 NASB] 38 And a man from the crowd shouted, saying, "Teacher, I beg You to look at my son, for he is my only[G3439] [boy,]
[Jhn 1:14, 18 NASB] 14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us, and we saw His glory, glory as of the only[G3439] begotten[G3439] from the Father, full of grace and truth. ... 18 No one has seen God at any time; the only[G3439] begotten[G3439] God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained [Him.]
[Jhn 3:16, 18 NASB] 16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only[G3439] begotten[G3439] Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. ... 18 "He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only[G3439] begotten[G3439] Son of God.
[Heb 11:17 NASB] 17 By faith Abraham, when he was tested, offered up Isaac, and he who had received the promises was offering up his only[G3439] begotten[G3439] [son;]
[1Jo 4:9 NASB] 9 By this the love of God was manifested in us, that God has sent His only[G3439] begotten[G3439] Son into the world so that we might live through Him.

 

CONCEIVED (G1080)

γεννάω gennáō, ghen-nah'-o; from a variation of G1085; to procreate (properly, of the father, but by extension of the mother); figuratively, to regenerate:—bear, beget, be born, bring forth, conceive, be delivered of, gender, make, spring.

 

Thayer’s Greek Lexicon

γεννάω, γέννω; future γεννήσω; 1 aorist ἐγέννησα; perfect γεγέννηκά; (passive, present γεννάομαι, γεννωμαι); perfect γεγέννημαι; 1 aorist ἐγεννήθην; (from γεννᾷ, poetic for γένος); in Greek writings from Pindar down; in the Sept. for יָלַד; to beget; 
1. properly: of men begetting children, Matthew 1:1-16; Acts 7:8, 29; followed by ἐκwith the genitive of the mother, Matthew 1:3, 5, 6; more rarely of women giving birth to children, Luke 1:13, 57; Luke 23:29; John 16:21; εἰς δουλείαν to bear a child unto bondage, that will be a slave, Galatians 4:24 ((Xenophon, de rep. Lac. 1, 3); Lucian, de sacrif. 6; Plutarch, de liber. educ. 5; others; the Sept. Isaiah 66:9; 4 Macc. 10:2, etc.). Passive, to be begotten: τό ἐν αὐτῇ γεννηθέν that which is begotten in her womb, Matthew 1:20; to be born: Matthew 2:1, 4 (Winers Grammar, 266 (250); Buttmann, 203 (176)); Matthew 19:12; 26:24; Mark 14:21; Luke 1:35; John 3:4; (Acts 7:20); Romans 9:11; Hebrews 11:23; with the addition εἰς τόν κόσμον, John 16:21; followed by ἐν with the dative of place, Acts 22:3; ἀπό τίνος, to spring from one as father, Hebrews 11:12 (L WH marginal reading ἐγεννήθησαν see Tdf.at the passage); ἐκ τίνος to be born of a mother, Matthew 1:16; ἐκ πορνείας, John 8:41; ἐξ αἱμάτων, ἐκ θελήματος ἀνδρός, John 1:13; ἐκ τῆς σαρκός, John 3:6 (Rec.elz γεγενημένον); ἐν ἁμαρτίαις ὅλος, John 9:34 (see ἁμαρτία, 2 a.); εἰς τί, to be born for something, John 18:37; 2 Peter 2:12 (Tdf. γεγενημένα so Rec.st bez); with an adjective: τυφλός γεγέννημαι, John 9:2, 19f, 32; Ῥωμαῖος to be supplied, Acts 22:28; τῇ διαλέκτῳ, ἐν ἡ ἐγεννήθημεν, Acts 2:8; γεννηθείς κατά σάρκα begotten or born according to (by) the working of natural passion; κατάπνεῦμα according to (by) the working of the divine promise, Galatians 4:29, cf. Galatians 4:23. 
2. metaphorically, 
a. universally, to engender, cause to arise, excite: μάχας, 2 Timothy 2:23 (βλαβην, λύπην, etc. in Greek writings). 
b. in a Jewish sense, of one who brings others over to his way of life: ὑμᾶς ἐγέννησα I am the author of your Christian life, 1 Corinthians 4:15; Philemon 1:10(Sanhedr. fol. 19, 2 "If one teaches the son of his neighbor the law, the Scripture reckons this the same as though he had begotten him"; (cf. Philo, leg. ad Gaium § 8)). 
c. after Psalm 2:7, it is used of God making Christ his son; 
a. formally to show him to be the Messiah (υἱόν τοῦ Θεοῦ), viz. by the resurrection: Acts 13:33. 
b. to be the author of the divine nature which he possesses (but compare the commentaries on the passages that follow): Hebrews 1:5; Hebrews 5:5. 
d. peculiarly, in the Gospel and First Epistle of John, of God conferring upon men the nature and disposition of his sons, imparting to them spiritual life, i. e. by his own holy power prompting and persuading souls to put faith in Christ and live a new life consecrated to himself; absolutely 1 John 5:1; mostly in passive, ἐκ Θεοῦ or ἐκ τοῦ Θεοῦ ἐγεννήθησαν, γεγέννηται, γεγεννημένος, etc.: John 1:13; 1 John 2:29(Rec.st γεγένηται); 1 John 3:9; 4:7; 5:1,4,18; also ἐκ τοῦ πνεύματος γέννασθαι, John 3:6 (Rec.elz γεγενημένον), John 3:8; ἐξ ὕδατος καί πνεύματος (because that moral generation is effected in receiving baptism ((?) cf. Schaff's Lange, Godet, Westcott, on the words, and references under the word βάπτισμα, 3)), John 3:5; ἄνωθεν γέννασθαι, John 3:3, 7 (see ἄνωθεν, c.) equivalent to τέκνον Θεοῦ γίνεσθαι, John 1:12. (Compare: ἀναγεννάω.) 

 

Found in (partial list):

[Mat 1:2-16, 20 NASB] 2 Abraham was the father[G1080] of Isaac, Isaac the father[G1080] of Jacob, and Jacob the father[G1080] of Judah and his brothers. 3 Judah was the father[G1080] of Perez and Zerah by Tamar, Perez was the father[G1080] of Hezron, and Hezron the father[G1080] of Ram. 4 Ram was the father[G1080] of Amminadab, Amminadab the father[G1080] of Nahshon, and Nahshon the father[G1080] of Salmon. 5 Salmon was the father[G1080] of Boaz by Rahab, Boaz was the father[G1080] of Obed by Ruth, and Obed the father[G1080] of Jesse. 6 Jesse was the father[G1080] of David the king. David was the father[G1080] of Solomon by Bathsheba who had been the wife of Uriah. 7 Solomon was the father[G1080] of Rehoboam, Rehoboam the father[G1080] of Abijah, and Abijah the father[G1080] of Asa. 8 Asa was the father[G1080] of Jehoshaphat, Jehoshaphat the father[G1080] of Joram, and Joram the father[G1080] of Uzziah. 9 Uzziah was the father[G1080] of Jotham, Jotham the father[G1080] of Ahaz, and Ahaz the father[G1080] of Hezekiah. 10 Hezekiah was the father[G1080] of Manasseh, Manasseh the father[G1080] of Amon, and Amon the father[G1080] of Josiah. 11 Josiah became[G1080] the father[G1080] of Jeconiah and his brothers, at the time of the deportation to Babylon. 12 After the deportation to Babylon: Jeconiah became[G1080] the father[G1080] of Shealtiel, and Shealtiel the father[G1080] of Zerubbabel. 13 Zerubbabel was the father[G1080] of Abihud, Abihud the father[G1080] of Eliakim, and Eliakim the father[G1080] of Azor. 14 Azor was the father[G1080] of Zadok, Zadok the father[G1080] of Achim, and Achim the father[G1080] of Eliud. 15 Eliud was the father[G1080] of Eleazar, Eleazar the father[G1080] of Matthan, and Matthan the father[G1080] of Jacob. 16 Jacob was the father[G1080] of Joseph the husband of Mary, by whom Jesus was born,[G1080] who is called the Messiah. ... 20 But when he had considered this, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared to him in a dream, saying, "Joseph, son of David, do not be afraid to take Mary as your wife; for the Child who has been conceived[G1080] in her is of the Holy Spirit.
[Mat 2:1, 4 NASB] 1 Now after Jesus was born[G1080] in Bethlehem of Judea in the days of Herod the king, magi from the east arrived in Jerusalem, saying, ... 4 Gathering together all the chief priests and scribes of the people, he inquired of them where the Messiah was to be born.[G1080]
[Mat 19:12 NASB] 12 "For there are eunuchs who were born[G1080] that way from their mother's womb; and there are eunuchs who were made eunuchs by men; and there are [also] eunuchs who made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. He who is able to accept [this,] let him accept [it.]"
[Mat 26:24 NASB] 24 "The Son of Man [is to] go, just as it is written of Him; but woe to that man by whom the Son of Man is betrayed! It would have been good for that man if he had not been born."[G1080]
[Mar 14:21 NASB] 21 "For the Son of Man [is to] go just as it is written of Him; but woe to that man by whom the Son of Man is betrayed! [It would have been] good for that man if he had not been born."[G1080]
[Luk 1:13, 35, 57 NASB] 13 But the angel said to him, "Do not be afraid, Zacharias, for your petition has been heard, and your wife Elizabeth will bear[G1080] you a son, and you will give him the name John. ... 35 The angel answered and said to her, "The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; and for that reason the holy Child[G1080] shall be called the Son of God. ... 57 Now the time had come for Elizabeth to give birth, and she gave[G1080] birth to a son.
[Luk 23:29 NASB] 29 "For behold, the days are coming when they will say, 'Blessed are the barren, and the wombs that never bore,[G1080] and the breasts that never nursed.'
[Jhn 1:13 NASB] 13 who were born,[G1080] not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.
[Jhn 3:3-8 NASB] 3 Jesus answered and said to him, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born[G1080] again he cannot see the kingdom of God." 4 Nicodemus said to Him, "How can a man be born[G1080] when he is old? He cannot enter a second time into his mother's womb and be born,[G1080] can he?" 5 Jesus answered, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born[G1080] of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. 6 "That which is born[G1080] of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born[G1080] of the Spirit is spirit. 7 "Do not be amazed that I said to you, 'You must be born[G1080] again.' 8 "The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born[G1080] of the Spirit."
[Jhn 8:41 NASB] 41 "You are doing the deeds of your father." They said to Him, "We were not born[G1080] of fornication; we have one Father: God."
[Jhn 9:2, 19-20, 32, 34 NASB] 2 And His disciples asked Him, "Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, that he would be born[G1080] blind?" ... 19 and questioned them, saying, "Is this your son, who you say was born[G1080] blind? Then how does he now see?" 20 His parents answered them and said, "We know that this is our son, and that he was born[G1080] blind; ... 32 "Since the beginning of time it has never been heard that anyone opened the eyes of a person born[G1080] blind. ... 34 They answered him, "You were born[G1080] entirely in sins, and are you teaching us?" So they put him out.
[Jhn 16:21 NASB] 21 "Whenever a woman is in labor she has pain, because her hour has come; but when she gives[G1080] birth[G1080] to the child, she no longer remembers the anguish because of the joy that a child has been born[G1080] into the world.
[Jhn 18:37 NASB] 37 Therefore Pilate said to Him, "So You are a king?" Jesus answered, "You say [correctly] that I am a king. For this I have been born,[G1080] and for this I have come into the world, to testify to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth hears My voice."
[Act 2:8 NASB] 8 "And how is it that we each hear [them] in our own language to which we were born?[G1080]
[Act 7:8, 20, 29 NASB] 8 "And He gave him the covenant of circumcision; and so [Abraham] became[G1080] the father[G1080] of Isaac, and circumcised him on the eighth day; and Isaac [became the father of] Jacob, and Jacob [of] the twelve patriarchs. ... 20 "It was at this time that Moses was born;[G1080] and he was lovely in the sight of God, and he was nurtured three months in his father's home. ... 29 "At this remark, MOSES FLED AND BECAME AN ALIEN IN THE LAND OF MIDIAN, where he became[G1080] the father[G1080] of two sons.
[Act 13:33 NASB] 33 that God has fulfilled this [promise] to our children in that He raised up Jesus, as it is also written in the second Psalm, 'YOU ARE MY SON; TODAY I HAVE BEGOTTEN[G1080] YOU.'
[Act 22:3, 28 NASB] 3 "I am a Jew, born[G1080] in Tarsus of Cilicia, but brought up in this city, educated under Gamaliel, strictly according to the law of our fathers, being zealous for God just as you all are today. ... 28 The commander answered, "I acquired this citizenship with a large sum of money." And Paul said, "But I was actually born[G1080] [a citizen.]"
[Rom 9:11 NASB] 11 for though [the twins] were not yet born[G1080] and had not done anything good or bad, so that God's purpose according to [His] choice would stand, not because of works but because of Him who calls,
[1Co 4:15 NASB] 15 For if you were to have countless tutors in Christ, yet [you would] not [have] many fathers, for in Christ Jesus I became[G1080] your father[G1080] through the gospel.
[Gal 4:23 NASB] 23 But the son by the bondwoman was born[G1080] according to the flesh, and the son by the free woman through the promise.

 

 

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On ‎7‎/‎28‎/‎2018 at 10:20 AM, Jedothek said:

Christian literature says both that the Holy Spirit begot Jesus and that the Father begot him. Perhaps they cooperated in some way. Would anyone care to comment?

Jesus was begotten by the Spirit of God joining the deity of God with the humanity of man in the womb of the virgin Mary. This is the only way Jesus could have entered into humanity being fully God and fully Man.  M

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