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Faber

Both Peter (Galatians 2:13) and John (Revelation 19:10) sinned

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Faber

For those who believe that a Christian never sins please explain how both Peter and Barnabas (Galatians 2:13) as well as John (Revelation 19:10) sinned.

 

Galatians 2:13

The rest of the Jews joined him in hypocrisy, with the result that even Barnabas was carried away by their hypocrisy. (NASB)

 

Revelation 19:10

Then I fell at his feet to worship him. But he said to me, “Do not do that; I am a fellow servant of yours and your brethren who hold the testimony of Jesus; worship God. For the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy.” (NASB)

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David Lee

Are there Christians here @ CF who believe that they never sin?

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atpollard
Are there Christians here @ CF who believe that they never sin?

Apparently I don't.

 

I thought I did, but my misunderstanding has been clarified by my Lutheran brothers.

It seems that when my atheist parents had me sprinkled in a Lutheran church at a few weeks old, I was baptized into the Grace.

So none of my sins counted.

 

Don't you wish your parents had planned ahead. ;)

 

(Hey, this is a joke ... except the part about being baptized Lutheran by Atheist parents ... that's true.)

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David Lee

Were your parents hedging their bet in your case?

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atpollard
Were your parents hedging their bet in your case?

It's worse than that. We attended THE church. You know, in every town there is one church where all the corporate up and comers go to be seen. So we moved every two years as my father clawed his way up the corporate ladder over people he shafted. In each new town we were regular attenders in THE church ... Christmas and Easter. The year and town I was born in, THE church was Lutheran.

 

In retrospect, what man meant for evil, God meant for good may apply. It was literally a "hell" of a journey, but God eventually cornered me and claimed me for his own. So perhaps God WAS marking me as the first in at least four generations to serve the Lord. Don't tell those other Lutherans or I'll never hear the end of Infant Baptism. :)

 

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Faber

We should also consider Paul.

 He was in the Temple (Acts 22) and this involved the offering of an animal sacrifice for sins which would belittle the sacrifice of Christ on the cross.

 His being there and a partaker of this offering was only prevented in that he was discovered by the Jews and was physically attacked.

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Innerfire89

How about Peter when he wouldn't eat with the Gentiles when the Jews were around? That was pride.

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Placable37

Just been discussing Old Testament Israel and how continually disobedient to God His "chosen people" were. Moses, Aaron, and Miriam, failed at times, as did the whole nation over and over again.

 Psalm 78:5-11
(5)  For he established a testimony in Jacob, and appointed a law in Israel, which he commanded our fathers, that they should make them known to their children:
(6)  That the generation to come might know them, even the children which should be born; who should arise and declare them to their children:
(7)  That they might set their hope in God, and not forget the works of God, but keep his commandments:
(8)  And might not be as their fathers, a stubborn and rebellious generation; a generation that set not their heart aright, and whose spirit was not stedfast with God.
(9)  The children of Ephraim, being armed, and carrying bows, turned back in the day of battle.
(10)  They kept not the covenant of God, and refused to walk in his law;
(11)  And forgat his works, and his wonders that he had shewed them.

 

The unwillingness of Israel to maintain an unfeigned and sincere profession of faith towards God is a theme throughout Psalm 78, which has 72 verses.  

Psalm 78:16-22
(16)  He brought streams also out of the rock, and caused waters to run down like rivers.
(17)  And they sinned yet more against him by provoking the most High in the wilderness.
(18)  And they tempted God in their heart by asking meat for their lust.
(19)  Yea, they spake against God;
they said, Can God furnish a table in the wilderness?
(20)  Behold, he smote the rock, that the waters gushed out, and the streams overflowed; can he give bread also? can he provide flesh for his people?
(21)  Therefore the LORD heard this, and was wroth: so a fire was kindled against Jacob, and anger also came up against Israel;
(22)  Because they believed not in God, and trusted not in his salvation:

 

Neither the judgments nor the  mercies of God stopped the decline of Israel into idolatry and rebellion.

 Psalm 78:31-42
(31)  The wrath of God came upon them, and slew the fattest of them, and smote down the chosen men of Israel.
(32)  For all this they sinned still, and believed not for his wondrous works.
(33)  Therefore their days did he consume in vanity, and their years in trouble.
(34)  When he slew them, then they sought him: and they returned and enquired early after God.
(35)  And they remembered that God was their rock, and the high God their redeemer.
(36)  Nevertheless they did flatter him with their mouth, and they lied unto him with their tongues.
(37)  For their heart was not right with him, neither were they stedfast in his covenant.
(38)  But he, being full of compassion, forgave their iniquity, and destroyed them not: yea, many a time turned he his anger away, and did not stir up all his wrath.
(39)  For he remembered that they were but flesh; a wind that passes away, and comes not again.
(40)  How oft did they provoke him in the wilderness, and grieve him in the desert!
(41)  Yea, they turned back and tempted God, and limited the Holy One of Israel.
(42)  They remembered not his hand, nor the day when he delivered them from the enemy.

 

The chastisements of God are intended to bring His people back into a faithful covenant relationship with Him, even if this means captivity by their enemies for a time.

Psalm 78:52-61
(52)  But made his own people to go forth like sheep, and guided them in the wilderness like a flock.
(53)  And he led them on safely, so that they feared not: but the sea overwhelmed their enemies.
(54)  And he brought them to the border of his sanctuary, even to this mountain, which his right hand had purchased.
(55)  He cast out the heathen also before them, and divided them an inheritance by line, and made the tribes of Israel to dwell in their tents.
(56)  Yet they tempted and provoked the most high God, and kept not his testimonies:
(57)  But turned back, and dealt unfaithfully like their fathers: they were turned aside like a deceitful bow.
(58)  For they provoked him to anger with their high places, and moved him to jealousy with their graven images.
(59)  When God heard this, he was wroth, and greatly abhorred Israel:
(60)  So that he forsook the tabernacle of Shiloh, the tent which he placed among men;
(61)  And delivered his strength into captivity, and his glory into the enemy's hand.

 

As Christians we are expected to learn from the mistakes of Israel.

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Becky
Moderator

Nice  to know i am normal. Thanks guys  :classic_smile:

 

Their disobedience cost them the Covenant. So very thankful for GRACE.

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sdowney717
On 6/30/2018 at 8:53 PM, Innerfire89 said:

How about Peter when he wouldn't eat with the Gentiles when the Jews were around? That was pride.

Not pride, but fear, it was like peer pressure and an actual work of the flesh playing out here. even though these gentiles God had saved them and there was to be no separation between them.

I looked at several versions, and they all use the word fear, not pride.

AMPC

12 For up to the time that certain persons came from James, he ate his meals with the Gentile [converts]; but when the men [from Jerusalem] arrived, he withdrew and held himself aloof from the Gentiles and [ate] separately for fear of those of the circumcision [party].

 

Galatians 2 NKJV

11 Now when [d]Peter had come to Antioch, I [e]withstood him to his face, because he was to be blamed; 12 for before certain men came from James, he would eat with the Gentiles; but when they came, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing those who were of the circumcision. 13 And the rest of the Jews also played the hypocrite with him, so that even Barnabas was carried away with their hypocrisy.

14 But when I saw that they were not straightforward about the truth of the gospel, I said to Peter before them all, “If you, being a Jew, live in the manner of Gentiles and not as the Jews, [g]why do you compel Gentiles to live as [h]Jews? 15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, 16 knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified.

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Faber
On 9/9/2016 at 9:43 PM, Faber said:

Galatians 2:13

The rest of the Jews joined him in hypocrisy, with the result that even Barnabas was carried away by their hypocrisy. (NASB, the bold face is mine)

 

  I think that it is interesting that the same Greek word for hypocrisy is later used by Peter in a sin to avoid.

 

1 Peter 2:1

Therefore, putting aside all malice and all deceit and hypocrisy and envy and all slander. (NASB, the bold face is mine)

https://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=G5272&t=NASB

 

 May we also condemn the sins we used to commit - Not with an air of arrogance, but in humility and thankfulness to our gracious and merciful God who abundantly pardons our foolish transgressions for the glory of His most holy Name.

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johnwayne
2 hours ago, Faber said:

 

  I think that it is interesting that the same Greek word for hypocrisy is later used by Peter in a sin to avoid.

 

 May we also condemn the sins we used to commit - Not with an air of arrogance, but in humility and thankfulness to our gracious and merciful God who abundantly pardons our foolish transgressions for the glory of His most holy Name.

Amen.

sin is our nature.

may lord pardon us.

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deade
On 12/16/2018 at 9:29 AM, sdowney717 said:

Not pride, but fear, it was like peer pressure and an actual work of the flesh playing out here. even though these gentiles God had saved them and there was to be no separation between them.

I looked at several versions, and they all use the word fear, not pride.

AMPC

12 For up to the time that certain persons came from James, he ate his meals with the Gentile [converts]; but when the men [from Jerusalem] arrived, he withdrew and held himself aloof from the Gentiles and [ate] separately for fear of those of the circumcision [party].

 

Galatians 2 NKJV

11 Now when [d]Peter had come to Antioch, I [e]withstood him to his face, because he was to be blamed; 12 for before certain men came from James, he would eat with the Gentiles; but when they came, he withdrew and separated himself, fearing those who were of the circumcision. 13 And the rest of the Jews also played the hypocrite with him, so that even Barnabas was carried away with their hypocrisy.

14 But when I saw that they were not straightforward about the truth of the gospel, I said to Peter before them all, “If you, being a Jew, live in the manner of Gentiles and not as the Jews, [g]why do you compel Gentiles to live as [h]Jews? 15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles, 16 knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law but by faith in Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Christ Jesus, that we might be justified by faith in Christ and not by the works of the law; for by the works of the law no flesh shall be justified.

They should have known better to accept a spirit of fear.

 

2 Tim. 1:7 "For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind."

 

Even with the HS guiding us, we can still get off track at times.

 

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davidtaylorjr
On 12/17/2018 at 11:20 PM, deade said:

Even with the HS guiding us, we can still get off track at times.

How true.

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