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Tree of knowledge of good and evil

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What’s known about the Tree of knowledge of good and evil? Only what is written at the beginning of the Book of Genesis. Then it takes all the Written Word of GOD to understand the matter.

 

And out of the ground made the LORD GOD to grow every tree that is pleasant to the sight, and good for food; the Tree of Life also in the midst of the Garden, and the Tree of knowledge of good and evil. (Genesis 2:9)

 

And the LORD GOD commanded the Man, saying, Of every tree of the Garden thou mayest freely eat: But of the Tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. (Genesis 2:16-17)

 

Then, Chapter 3 of the Book of Genesis described our fall and ended this way:

 

And the LORD GOD said, Behold, the Man is become as one of Us, to know Good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the Tree of Life, and eat, and live for ever: Therefore the LORD GOD sent him forth from the Garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken. So He drove out the Man; and He placed at the east of the Garden of Eden Cherubims, and a Flaming Sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the Tree of Life. (Genesis 3:22-24)

 

The end of the story. Let’s be reminded, by the way, that Genesis 3:22 is GOD’s sarcasm.

 

Well, the story left out some questions, which I try to get the Answers to.

 

The first. What did the name of the tree mean? GOD’s Test & Warning, no more. Because only GOD gives Knowledge & Understanding, not any tree.

 

Consequently, the second question: how were the fruits of the Tree of knowledge of good and evil supposed to work? By Genesis 2:16-17, to live eternally we were (and still are) going to have to be Obedient to GOD. Therefore, the only Reason why the Tree of knowledge of good and evil existed at all, was Prohibition. The fruits thereof were prohibited in favor of our Strict Obedience to Heavenly Father.

 

Mind Satan’s interest in our being fed on that tree. He was (and is) himself disobedient to the LORD and purposed to spread that disobedience throughout all Creation. The evil one has always done that by propagating the worldly reason, a.k.a. “common sense,” which is nothing but corrupted seeing of good & evil.

 

Taking the way of disobedience, we moved away from GOD and Communion with His Holy Spirit discontinued. When He leaves us, immediately the evil spirit stepped forward. No, it wasn’t a work of a tree, but the terrible change in the Spirit Realm.

That “step-back-step-forward” principle, or else the move of the Light-darkness frontier is a matter of GOD’s Punishment and another discussion.

 

Little children are called naive. Well, instead of learning from them, their parents teach them “wisdom.” And their young eyes get opened to see “good” and “evil” from Satan’s perspective.

 

So, the satanic reason became the “processor” of the human mind. Genesis 3:7.

 

Now, we can better see the third and most important point – why were those fruits forbidden – only for our Good.

As you know, human brainpower can be useful or dangerous, as it can protect & save or ignore & destroy the World created, our sorry selves inclusive, depending on where that power is directed.

 

Shall we be disobedient to Father GOD and live forever? No way. May the Wisdom of GOD be praised!

 

The Tree of knowledge of good and evil could best serve people when left alone. It wasn’t the indispensable one in the Great Garden of GOD. Genesis 1:29-31.

 

As for the Tree itself, it was as wooden as any other, without any hidden mystery or powers or so. Its fruits were nice & tasty (Genesis 3:6) but in no way exceeded the physical value of those of the Tree of Life, which were to be most useful.

 

They say, when GOD closes one door, He opens another.

So, there is a sure Way back to GOD. Luke 15:20.

 

...men do not become Christians by associating with Church people, nor by Religious contact, nor by Religious education; they become Christians only by Invasion of their nature by the Spirit of GOD in the New Birth. (A.W. Tozer, GOD’s Pursuit Of Man)

 

(Our “Christian Mind” Ministry, “Q & A” book, chapter 440)

 

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Origen
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2 hours ago, Igor said:

Let’s be reminded, by the way, that Genesis 3:22 is GOD’s sarcasm.

Cite the linguistic and\or literary evidence within the text itself which points to this as being sarcasm.

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William
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3 hours ago, Igor said:

What’s known about the Tree of knowledge of good and evil? Only what is written at the beginning of the Book of Genesis. Then it takes all the Written Word of GOD to understand the matter.

There are all kinds of matters surrounding the Tree of Knowledge of good and evil.

 

For example, what appealed to Eve? What was Eve sold on by the serpent? What was it about wisdom that Eve desired? Why did she desire to lead man or Adam and was it any coincidence that God should stress her contention and yet she shall be subject to her husband's headship?

 

I think the most interesting thing about the Tree is that the tree hosted the serpent and ultimately be used to sell the serpents doctrine. The serpent beared no fruit of himself but rather sold the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. Here is what is most peculiar to me about the serpent's lies as I do believe most of Christendom today conveys and teaches this very same lie.

 

Genesis 3:5 For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.” Note the lies of the serpent,

  1. she would be like gods, and thus independent
  2. able to rule over herself apart from God, and
  3. there is not one God, but many gods; each is sovereign over himself or herself.

This is the only place where autonomous will or what is known as "free will" is taught in Scripture. Man in himself having an autonomous nature. Whenever I hear someone teaching the doctrine of free will (autonomous or libertarian) I am reminded of the source of the Devil's doctrine.

 

Isaiah 14:11-15

“Thy pomp is brought down to the grave, and the noise of thy viols:
the worm is spread under thee, and the worms cover thee.
How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning!
how art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations!
For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven,
I will exalt my throne above the stars of God:
I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.
Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit.”

 

The very same inequity found in Lucifer was used by him through the serpent to outwardly tempt an "unrighteous" creature.  And to clarify, I mean Adam had not a divine or righteous nature but rather he was blameless up until this point. If Adam was righteous He would not of been mislead by Eve and Adam would of crushed the head of the serpent right then and there and to its effect none of us would be in this mess.

 

3 hours ago, Igor said:

They say, when GOD closes one door, He opens another.

Whenever I hear this I ask what about those outside Noah's ark? Once the door closed what other door had God opened for them?

 

God bless,

William

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Origen
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Just now, William said:

Whenever I hear this I ask what about those outside Noah's ark? Once the door closed what other door had God opened for them?

Absolutely brilliant!!!

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7 minutes ago, Origen said:

Cite the linguistic and\or literary evidence within the text itself which points to this as being sarcasm.

Do you have a better interpretation?

Actually, it's not my invention. I met it in some commentaries of Teachers (They are named in my "Q & A.") and accepted. 

The same I state regarding Matthew 5:30.

Thank you.

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Origen
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19 minutes ago, Igor said:

Do you have a better interpretation?

I made no claim at all.  You, on the other hard, did.  You said it was sarcasm.  Either you have linguistic and\or literary evidence for your claim or you don't.  Clearly you don't.  If you did you would have presented it rather than trying to deflect and place the burden of proof upon me to disprove claimed.  Sorry that is not how this works.  Thank you very much.  Now we know what we need to know.

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7 minutes ago, Origen said:

Either you have linguistic and\or literary evidence for your claim or you don't.  Clearly you don't.  If you did you would have presented it rather than trying to deflect and place the burden of proof upon me for something you claimed.  Thank you very much now we know what we need to know.

I repeat, I read the term in the comments and accepted it. May try to find out.

I load upon you nothing. Rather you make me a liar. Prove that on. 

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Origen
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4 minutes ago, Igor said:

Rather you make me a liar. Prove that on. 

Prove me wrong and post the linguistic and\or literary evidence for your claim.  That is all you have to do.  Yet rather than simply posting the evidence you prefer again to deflect.  I wonder what that could mean?

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William
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32 minutes ago, Igor said:

Do you have a better interpretation?

Actually, it's not my invention. I met it in some commentaries of Teachers (They are named in my "Q & A.") and accepted. 

The same I state regarding Matthew 5:30.

Thank you.

I wouldn't necessarily take that as sarcasm. I think a far better verse might be:

 

Luke 5:30-32

And the Pharisees and their scribes grumbled at his disciples, saying, “Why do you eat and drink with tax collectors and sinners?”
And Jesus answered them, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick.
I have not come to call the righteous but sinners to repentance.”
 

Why do I think the above is sarcasm? Because Jesus says the complete opposite. The Pharisees and scribes were in themselves not righteous but self-righteous and in need of Jesus Christ. And while Jesus establishes a point through the imagery of a physician and the sick the very people He is addressing are not sick but dead in sin and trespass. They do not need what Jesus is saying they need, that is a doctor, for they are dead, the Pharisees and scribes are in need of the savior to resurrect them from death unto life Ephesians 2:5.

 

If saying the opposite and emphasizing it to the point of exposing folly is not sarcasm I don't know what is.

 

Proverbs 26:4-5

Answer not a fool according to his folly,
    lest you be like him yourself.
 Answer a fool according to his folly,
    lest he be wise in his own eyes.

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William
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3 hours ago, Igor said:

The end of the story. Let’s be reminded, by the way, that Genesis 3:22 is GOD’s sarcasm.

I think it would be enough if you just elaborate on the verse above and why you think it is sarcasm.

 

That is, if you still do now that it has been brought into focus.

 

God bless,

William

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Origen
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19 minutes ago, William said:

I wouldn't necessarily take that as sarcasm.

You are correct it (i.e. Matt. 5:30) is not sarcasm.  It is hyperbole.

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William
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10 minutes ago, Origen said:

You are correct it (i.e. Matt. 5:30) is not sarcasm.  It is hyperbole.

Maybe we need besides our Sarcasm Monday a Hyperbole Friday. Let's all exaggerate our time to ourselves come the weekend on Friday. Monday lets promote Sarcasm towards others for having to lift our focus off ourselves onto our fellow man.

 

I'm so tempted to do such thing. A banner on top of the board defining which day it is throughout the week and how to engage each other.


I find this amusing and entertaining!

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55 minutes ago, Origen said:

Prove me wrong and post the linguistic and\or literary evidence for your claim.  That is all you have to do.  Yet rather than simply posting the evidence you prefer again to deflect.  I wonder what that could mean?

Sarcasm = A keen, reproachful expression; a satirical remark uttered
 with some degree of scorn or contempt; a taunt; a gibe; a
 cutting jest.  [1913 Webster]

 

Is that you need?

You also told: "Now we know what we need to know."

So, stop speaking in generalities, OK? 

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1 hour ago, William said:

There are all kinds of matters surrounding the Tree of Knowledge of good and evil.

Brother Wolliam, you are right. There are a lot of matters surrounding that tree.

However, I answered the question (asked long ago) about the tree itself, no more. 

Thank you.

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Origen
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32 minutes ago, Igor said:

Sarcasm = A keen, reproachful expression; a satirical remark uttered
 with some degree of scorn or contempt; a taunt; a gibe; a
 cutting jest.  [1913 Webster]

 

Is that you need?

You also told: "Now we know what we need to know."

So, stop speaking in generalities, OK? 

I did not ask for a definition.  I said: Cite the linguistic and\or literary evidence within the text itself which points to this as being sarcasm.

 

32 minutes ago, Igor said:

You also told: "Now we know what we need to know."

So, stop speaking in generalities, OK? 

I wasn't speaking in generalities.  My point was clear.  I asked you to "Cite the linguistic and\or literary evidence within the text itself which points to this as being sarcasm."  You didn't and you still haven't.  It is clear what that means.

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William
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Then the Lord God said, “Behold, the man has become like one of us in knowing good and evil. Now, lest he reach out his hand rand take also of the tree of life and eat, and live forever—”

 

I love this kinda discussion bear with my musing.

 

Lemme ask [anyone] if I may, was man in need of experiencing rebellion in order to discern good and evil? That is, must all men experience a prodigal moment rather than in obedience?

 

Man is made in the image of God he is in likeness in such way that he shares God's faculties though limited finitely. For example, man shares the ability to reason, love, etc. Without these very faculties as image bearers we would not be able to relate to God.

 

Further, if you note everything in creation was good up until the first negatives. The first negative command was given in Genesis 2:17. The first negative narration followed in that it was not good for Adam being alone Genesis 2:18. I'm curious on this point as to whether there was an implicit positive command given as to Genesis 2:17-18? A universal oughtness if you will?

 

So here's my question, is discerning good and evil righteous or unrighteous? And could Adam if in obedience learned to discern right from wrong if he had not fallen into disobedience? Was such discernment against God's intent as Satan suggests? Or was it the timing and nature of such method which Adam trespassed? So much of our society today emphasizes experience  and learning from mistakes rather than avoiding them through biblical obedience ~ wisdom.

 

On another point, note what follows out of the Garden of Eden. We have righteousness such as a preacher of righteousness Noah Genesis 6:9. The very thing Adam failed in which ought to have began with Eve instead followed forth from offspring. Adam failed in so many ways as spiritual head. In a lot of ways he reminds me of Esau which only cared about laboring for food (hunting) etc rather than the responsibilities of spiritual headship.

 

How has Adam becoming "like" one of us knowing good and evil sarcastic? Man of course is not God, even in the verse he is disqualified of immortality because he has not ate of the tree of life which will be soon guarded by the flaming sword of a Cherubim Genesis 3:24.

 

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2 minutes ago, Origen said:

 

I wasn't speaking in generalities.  My point was clear.  I asked you to "Cite the linguistic and\or literary evidence within the text itself which points to this as being sarcasm."  You didn't and you still haven't.

"linguistic and\or literary evidence" - that stuff I don't understand. If you are linguist that doesn't make you of any better Understanding.

"Now we know what we need to know" - and in that stuff, what is yours?

Now, tell your last stuff and we stop at that.  

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27 minutes ago, Origen said:

I did not ask for a definition.  I said: Cite the linguistic and\or literary evidence within the text itself which points to this as being sarcasm.

 

I wasn't speaking in generalities.  My point was clear.  I asked you to "Cite the linguistic and\or literary evidence within the text itself which points to this as being sarcasm."  You didn't and you still haven't.

 

2 hours ago, Origen said:
2 hours ago, William said:
5 hours ago, Igor said:

They say, when GOD closes one door, He opens another.

Whenever I hear this I ask what about those outside Noah's ark? Once the door closed what other door had God opened for them?

 

William, we speak about different things.

I meant the Way to GOD. And clarified: the Way of Prodigal Son.

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Origen
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29 minutes ago, Igor said:

"linguistic and\or literary evidence" - that stuff I don't understand.

You are correct.

 

29 minutes ago, Igor said:

If you are linguist that doesn't make you of any better Understanding.

I never said anything about being better.  I asked for evidence.  You don't have any evidence for your claim.  That was my point which you have proven.

 

 

 

 

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William
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33 minutes ago, Igor said:

I meant the Way to GOD. And clarified: the Way of Prodigal Son.

I'm pretty sure those outside Noah's ark found no other way to God at that point. On that topic I think Adam, Eve, Esau, Saul, and Judas might have a problem with that cliche.

 

Don't know about you bro but it was a wake up call when I began questioning and searching the Scriptures to verify most Christian cliches.

 

Just because someone is a Charismatic or has a following doesn't excuse them from Sola Scriptura.

 

The Prodigal son gets too much attention for his rebellion. Scripturally speaking the father didn't put him in front of a congregation to give a testimony and air out all his dirty laundry. As a Prodigal myself my testimony is short, "all this could be avoided if I were just submissive and obedient". But nah, people want to emphasize that life is about trial and error. It is repeating the same mistakes in an age old echo from out of Eden.

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18 minutes ago, Origen said:

I never said anything about being better.  I asked for evidence.  You don't have any evidence for your claim.  That was my point which you have proven.

Like I said, we stop at that, Mr. "ignored user."

 

10 minutes ago, William said:

I'm pretty sure those outside Noah's ark found no other way to God at that point. On that topic I think Adam, Eve, Esau, Saul, and Judas might have a problem with that cliche.

 

Don't know about you bro but it was a wake up call when I began questioning and searching the Scriptures to verify most Christian cliches.

 

Just because someone is a Charismatic or has a following doesn't excuse them from Sola Scriptura.

William, regarding the persons you named, I'm almost sure only about Saul & Judas Iscariot. Their suicide cut the Way. Don't know about others. Master Luther saw Adam as GOD's Prophet and sympathized Eve. GOD bless.

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Origen
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Just now, Igor said:

Like I said, we stop at that, Mr. "ignored user."

https://www.christforums.com/staff/

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William
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2 minutes ago, Igor said:

Like I said, we stop at that, Mr. "ignored user."

 

William, regarding the persons you named, I'm almost sure only about Saul & Judas Iscariot. Their suicide cut the Way. Don't know about others. Master Luther saw Adam as GOD's Prophet and sympathized Eve. GOD bless.

Master Luther? Please provide a quote and reference?

 

I hope you welcome the resistance you're receiving on this board with gladness? Like a muscle that needs resistance weight in order to grow so we believe that intellectual debate stimulates growth of the mind. Too many Christians are touchy feely in my opinion. They may exhibit a heart after God but too many haven't a transformed mind according to the word of God.

 

God bless,

William

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13 hours ago, William said:

I hope you welcome the resistance you're receiving on this board with gladness?

I love it. In due memory of Spiritual Warfare we wage.

 

William,

Please find attached herewith some screen-shots of –

 

The Creation: A Commentary on the First Five Chapters of the Book of Genesis. By Martin Luther. Originally published at Witenberg in the year of our Lord 1544; and now first translated into English, by Henry Cole, Edinburgh, 1858

 

– pages 296, 327, 330, 347.

 

That took quite a time surprising me a bit. For about a year ago I switched from Windows OS (with very good Foxit reader) to Linux OS (with less strong Okular reader). Never mind.

Yeah, when I state something, which has been clear to me from long ago and later asked for a proof, then the bloody search begins.

That’s why I don’t copy other pages of Brother Luther’s works.

The above-named book is worthy to be read.

 

GOD bless you.

Igor

Screenshot at 2019-08-26 04-51-27.png

Screenshot at 2019-08-26 06-16-10.png

Screenshot at 2019-08-26 06-29-20.png

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Ronald

God is sovereign, He knew what would happen.

Questions:  The Garden was perfect physically. But how perfect can an environment be with the potential of evil present? That the tree was there and Satan to tempt Eve to open the door to the knowledge of evil was putting them in harms way - wasn't it? But wait, the tree wasn't just the door/path to the knowledge of evil, it was also the door path to the knowledge of good. 

We cannot know, understand or appreciate the love of God and everything that is good unless we learn what it is like to be without it. We need to experience the opposite. We could not know what faith, forgiveness, mercy, love, joy, peace, the light or any of the attributes of God until we experience all the various kinds of evils.

This was a perfect plan that God ordained. I know you've heard differently. 

So, now we know good and evil. And God had a plan before the foundation of the earth did He not? A solution. Jesus demonstrated the greatest act of love in His suffering and death. It was part of the plan. 

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