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Innerfire89

Does 2 Peter 2 teach that you can lose salvation?

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To some it would seem that verses in second Peter  2 Peter 2 teach that salvation can be lost, but that's not the case.

 

1But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction.

 

Peter first mentions the false prophets of the old testament who were also bought out of bondage with the rest of Israel, yet not all Israel is Israel, just as all Christians are not Christians.

 

 2And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3And in their greed they will exploit you with false words. Their condemnation from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.

4For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept until the judgment; 5if he did not spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah, a herald of righteousness, with seven others, when he brought a flood upon the world of the ungodly; 6if by turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to ashes he condemned them to extinction, making them an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly; 7and if he rescued righteous Lot, greatly distressed by the sensual conduct of the wicked8(for as that righteous man lived among them day after day, he was tormenting his righteous soul over their lawless deeds that he saw and heard); 9then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from trials, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment until the day of judgment, 

 

Now Peter assures that these false teachers will not go unpunished just as the false prophets of old.

 

Who is being rescued? And who the is the unrightieous being kept under punishment in verse 9?

God preserves the godly, His elect, He did it then and does it now with us and false teachers.

 

10and especially those who indulgee in the lust of defiling passion and despise authority.

Bold and willful, they do not tremble as they blaspheme the glorious ones, 11whereas angels, though greater in might and power, do not pronounce a blasphemous judgment against them before the Lord. 12But these, like irrational animals, creatures of instinct, born to be caught and destroyed, blaspheming about matters of which they are ignorant, will also be destroyed in their destruction,

 

Irrational animals, creatures of instinct, is that the nature Christian or one who has never been regenerated, never became a new creature in Christ, depraved as they've always been.

 

13suffering wrong as the wage for their wrongdoing. They count it pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are blots and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, while they feast with you. 14They have eyes full of adultery, insatiable for sin. They entice unsteady souls. They have hearts trained in greed. Accursed children! 

15Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved gain from wrongdoing, 16but was rebuked for his own transgression; a speechless donkey spoke with human voice and restrained the prophet’s madness.

17These are waterless springs and mists driven by a storm. For them the gloom of utter darkness has been reserved. 18For, speaking loud boasts of folly, they entice by sensual passions of the flesh those who are barely escaping from those who live in error. 19They promise them freedom, but they themselves are slaves of corruption. For whatever overcomes a person, to that he is enslaved. 20For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. 21For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. 22What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”

 

That "if" in verse 20 is there for a reason, IF they had excaped the pollutions of the world. It's hypothetical, if it were so it would be worse.

In a few versions verse 22 starts with "but" and rightly so, if it were this way but it's like this.

The proverb is true of them, they are like dogs who return to thier vomit.

The nature of a dog is to return to it's vomit, but Christians take on a new nature.

If these false teachers were saved, then that would mean that all Christians are dogs who do the same.

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16 hours ago, Innerfire89 said:

To some it would seem that verses in second Peter  2 Peter 2 teach that salvation can be lost, but that's not the case.

 

1But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction.

 

Peter first mentions the false prophets of the old testament who were also bought out of bondage with the rest of Israel, yet not all Israel is Israel, just as all Christians are not Christians.

 

 2And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3And in their greed they will exploit you with false words. Their condemnation from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.

4For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept until the judgment; 5if he did not spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah, a herald of righteousness, with seven others, when he brought a flood upon the world of the ungodly; 6if by turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to ashes he condemned them to extinction, making them an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly; 7and if he rescued righteous Lot, greatly distressed by the sensual conduct of the wicked8(for as that righteous man lived among them day after day, he was tormenting his righteous soul over their lawless deeds that he saw and heard); 9then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from trials, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment until the day of judgment, 

 

Now Peter assures that these false teachers will not go unpunished just as the false prophets of old.

 

Who is being rescued? And who the is the unrightieous being kept under punishment in verse 9?

God preserves the godly, His elect, He did it then and does it now with us and false teachers.

 

10and especially those who indulgee in the lust of defiling passion and despise authority.

Bold and willful, they do not tremble as they blaspheme the glorious ones, 11whereas angels, though greater in might and power, do not pronounce a blasphemous judgment against them before the Lord. 12But these, like irrational animals, creatures of instinct, born to be caught and destroyed, blaspheming about matters of which they are ignorant, will also be destroyed in their destruction,

 

Irrational animals, creatures of instinct, is that the nature Christian or one who has never been regenerated, never became a new creature in Christ, depraved as they've always been.

 

13suffering wrong as the wage for their wrongdoing. They count it pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are blots and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, while they feast with you. 14They have eyes full of adultery, insatiable for sin. They entice unsteady souls. They have hearts trained in greed. Accursed children! 

15Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved gain from wrongdoing, 16but was rebuked for his own transgression; a speechless donkey spoke with human voice and restrained the prophet’s madness.

17These are waterless springs and mists driven by a storm. For them the gloom of utter darkness has been reserved. 18For, speaking loud boasts of folly, they entice by sensual passions of the flesh those who are barely escaping from those who live in error. 19They promise them freedom, but they themselves are slaves of corruption. For whatever overcomes a person, to that he is enslaved. 20For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. 21For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. 22What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”

 

That "if" in verse 20 is there for a reason, IF they had excaped the pollutions of the world. It's hypothetical, if it were so it would be worse.

In a few versions verse 22 starts with "but" and rightly so, if it were this way but it's like this.

The proverb is true of them, they are like dogs who return to thier vomit.

The nature of a dog is to return to it's vomit, but Christians take on a new nature.

If these false teachers were saved, then that would mean that all Christians are dogs who do the same.

Hi IF....

I read the above and I do see what you mean by the word "if"....

I'm marking this for tomorrow...It's past 11 pm here.

 

Good night!

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On 3/30/2019 at 6:56 AM, Innerfire89 said:

To some it would seem that verses in second Peter  2 Peter 2 teach that salvation can be lost, but that's not the case.

 

1But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction.

 

Bringing upon themselves swift destruction.....speaking of false teachers.

Which is a scary thought for teachers that are teaching incorrect doctrine.

This brings to mind James 3:1

There is much responsibility toward teaching and we'll respond to God regarding this.

Quote

 

Peter first mentions the false prophets of the old testament who were also bought out of bondage with the rest of Israel, yet not all Israel is Israel, just as all Christians are not Christians.

 

 2And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3And in their greed they will exploit you with false words. Their condemnation from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.

Good.....

Quote

4For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept until the judgment; 5if he did not spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah, a herald of righteousness, with seven others, when he brought a flood upon the world of the ungodly; 6if by turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to ashes he condemned them to extinction, making them an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly; 7and if he rescued righteous Lot, greatly distressed by the sensual conduct of the wicked8(for as that righteous man lived among them day after day, he was tormenting his righteous soul over their lawless deeds that he saw and heard); 9then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from trials, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment until the day of judgment, 

 

Now Peter assures that these false teachers will not go unpunished just as the false prophets of old.

 

Who is being rescued? And who the is the unrightieous being kept under punishment in verse 9?

God preserves the godly, His elect, He did it then and does it now with us and false teachers.

 

Agreed...but where does it say His Elect? (that God preserves the godly, His Elect)

Quote

 

10and especially those who indulgee in the lust of defiling passion and despise authority.

Bold and willful, they do not tremble as they blaspheme the glorious ones, 11whereas angels, though greater in might and power, do not pronounce a blasphemous judgment against them before the Lord. 12But these, like irrational animals, creatures of instinct, born to be caught and destroyed, blaspheming about matters of which they are ignorant, will also be destroyed in their destruction,

 

Irrational animals, creatures of instinct, is that the nature Christian or one who has never been regenerated, never became a new creature in Christ, depraved as they've always been.

 

Peter is speaking about the false teachers, not believers....

Quote

 

13suffering wrong as the wage for their wrongdoing. They count it pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are blots and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, while they feast with you. 14They have eyes full of adultery, insatiable for sin. They entice unsteady souls. They have hearts trained in greed. Accursed children! 

Good.

Now come the important verses.

Quote

15Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved gain from wrongdoing, 16but was rebuked for his own transgression; a speechless donkey spoke with human voice and restrained the prophet’s madness.

Forsaking the right way....

 

You cannot forsake something you never had...

The false teachers had the right way,,,now they have forsaken it, they no longer have the right way...

 

ccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccc

forsake

 

abandon or leave.

"he would never forsake Tara"

synonyms:abandon, desert, leave, quit, depart from, leave behind, leave high and dry, turn one's back on, cast aside, give up, reject, disown; More

renounce or give up (something valued or pleasant).

"I won't forsake my vegetarian principles"

synonyms:renounce, give up, relinquish, dispense with, forgo, desist from, forswear, disclaim, disown, disavow, discard, set aside, wash one's hands of, turn one's back on, repudiate, have done with; 

 

ccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccc

Quote

17These are waterless springs and mists driven by a storm. For them the gloom of utter darkness has been reserved. 18For, speaking loud boasts of folly, they entice by sensual passions of the flesh those who are barely escaping from those who live in error. 19They promise them freedom, but they themselves are slaves of corruption.

 

Utter darkness is reserved for the false teachers that have forsaken the right way and now wish to attract others to their wrong ways... (by promising them freedom)

Quote

 

For whatever overcomes a person, to that he is enslaved.

 

We are a slave to the thing that overcomes us...(stealing, drugs, etc.)

Quote

 

20For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. 21For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. 22What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”

 

That "if" in verse 20 is there for a reason, IF they had excaped the pollutions of the world. It's hypothetical, if it were so it would be worse.

 

This is not what the IF means.

The false teachers had escaped the defilement of the world..now they are AGAIN entangled (as they used to be) in these defilements and have been overcome by them.

 

IF, after escaping...is NOT conditional....they had IN FACT escaped the defilements of the world and now are AGAIN....otherwise the AGAIN would not make any sense.

 

 

They were defiled by the world     then,

They were rightly following God    then,

They were AGAIN defiled by the world.

 

And this state made them be worse than the first because now THEY KNEW THE TRUTH!  Which they did not know in their original state of being defiled from the beginning BEFORE they knew God and the right way.

 

It's not hypothetical or conditional.

 

It's explain an actual condition that the false teachers were in.

 

 

Quote

In a few versions verse 22 starts with "but" and rightly so, if it were this way but it's like this.

The proverb is true of them, they are like dogs who return to thier vomit.

The nature of a dog is to return to it's vomit, but Christians take on a new nature.

If these false teachers were saved, then that would mean that all Christians are dogs who do the same.

What?  All Christians go back to being lost?  Is this what you're saying?

This is false, of course and I'm sure you must agree.

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3 hours ago, GodsGrace said:

Agreed...but where does it say His Elect? (that God preserves the godly, His Elect)

It doesn't say the elect, that's who the godly are though.

 

3 hours ago, GodsGrace said:

 

This is not what the IF means.

The false teachers had escaped the defilement of the world..now they are AGAIN entangled (as they used to be) in these defilements and have been overcome by them.

 

IF, after escaping...is NOT conditional....they had IN FACT escaped the defilements of the world and now are AGAIN....otherwise the AGAIN would not make any sense.

 

 

They were defiled by the world     then,

They were rightly following God    then,

They were AGAIN defiled by the world.

 

And this state made them be worse than the first because now THEY KNEW THE TRUTH!  Which they did not know in their original state of being defiled from the beginning BEFORE they knew God and the right way.

 

It's not hypothetical or conditional.

 

It's explain an actual condition that the false teachers were in.

I don't see why if wouldn't mean if here.

 

3 hours ago, GodsGrace said:
Quote

son of Beor, who loved gain from wrongdoing, 16but was rebuked for his own transgression; a speechless donkey spoke with human voice and restrained the prophet’s madness.

Read more  

Forsaking the right way....

 

You cannot forsake something you never had...

The false teachers had the right way,,,now they have forsaken it, they no longer have the right way...

 

ccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccc

forsake

 

abandon or leave.

"he would never forsake Tara"

synonyms:abandon, desert, leave, quit, depart from, leave behind, leave high and dry, turn one's back on, cast aside, give up, reject, disown; More

renounce or give up (something valued or pleasant).

"I won't forsake my vegetarian principles"

synonyms:renounce, give up, relinquish, dispense with, forgo, desist from, forswear, disclaim, disown, disavow, discard, set aside, wash one's hands of, turn one's back on, repudiate, have done with; 

 

ccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccccc

Forsaking the right way does not equate to losing salvation.

The knew of the right way and departed from it.

3 hours ago, GodsGrace said:

What?  All Christians go back to being lost?  Is this what you're saying?

This is false, of course and I'm sure you must agree.

Of course it's false, no Christians lose thier salvation. 

Who are the dogs that always return to thier vomit? The dogs always returns to it, so whoever the dogs are will inevitably return to thier vomit.

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19 hours ago, Innerfire89 said:

It doesn't say the elect, that's who the godly are though.

 

This is what you believe.

As I understand the N.T.,,,,the elect are the Jews.

I won't continue on this path because I realize I'm in calvinist territory and we each can believe what we will....

19 hours ago, Innerfire89 said:

 

I don't see why if wouldn't mean if here.

 

It's simple English IF....

If, AFTER EATING THE CAKE, you return to being hungry,,,you'll be worse off than before.

 

The person was HUNGRY

They ate CAKE

They're STILL HUNGRY and are worse off than before.

 

For could be BECAUSE.....

2 Peter 2:20

Because,,,If, AFTER they have escaped the defilement of the world by the KNOWLEDGE of Jesus,,,,

They are AGAIN entangled in the defilement of the world....

they will be worse off than before.

 

The person was entangled in defilement

They became saved by knowing Jesus

They are AGAIN entangled in defilement

 

Lost

Saved

Lost

 

19 hours ago, Innerfire89 said:

 

Forsaking the right way does not equate to losing salvation.

The knew of the right way and departed from it.

Of course it's false, no Christians lose thier salvation. 

Who are the dogs that always return to thier vomit? The dogs always returns to it, so whoever the dogs are will inevitably return to thier vomit.

There are only two ways to go...

toward satan,

toward God.

 

If I forsake the way toward God and go toward satan...

I'm STILL SAVED?

 

Could you exegete the following please?

 

Colossians 1:22-23

 22yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach

23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.

 

In the above verses Paul clearly states that we will be presented holy and blameless 

IF

we continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel heard.

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On 4/1/2019 at 4:45 PM, Innerfire89 said:

It doesn't say the elect, that's who the godly are though.

Opening verses in 1 Peter and 2 Peter answer to who both letters are addressed.

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7 hours ago, GodsGrace said:

 

This is what you believe.

As I understand the N.T.,,,,the elect are the Jews.

I won't continue on this path because I realize I'm in calvinist territory and we each can believe what we will....

Titus 1:1

1Paul, a servant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ, for the sake of the faith of God’s elect and their knowledge of the truth, which accords with godliness.

 

Who would you say the elect are according to this verse?

7 hours ago, GodsGrace said:

 

It's simple English IF....

If, AFTER EATING THE CAKE, you return to being hungry,,,you'll be worse off than before.

 

The person was HUNGRY

They ate CAKE

They're STILL HUNGRY and are worse off than before.

 

For could be BECAUSE.....

2 Peter 2:20

Because,,,If, AFTER they have escaped the defilement of the world by the KNOWLEDGE of Jesus,,,,

They are AGAIN entangled in the defilement of the world....

they will be worse off than before.

 

The person was entangled in defilement

They became saved by knowing Jesus

They are AGAIN entangled in defilement

 

Lost

Saved

Lost

if

/if/

Learn to pronounce

conjunction

1.

(introducing a conditional clause) on the condition or supposition that; in the event that.

"if you have a complaint, write to the director"

synonyms:on condition that, provided (that), providing (that), presuming (that), supposing (that), assuming (that), on the assumption that, allowing (that), as long as, given that, with the provision/proviso that, with/on the understanding that, if and only if, contingent on, in the event that, allowing that

"if the weather is fine, we can walk to the village"

2.

despite the possibility that; no matter whether.

"if it takes me seven years, I shall do it"

noun

1.

a condition or supposition.

"there are so many ifs and buts in the policy"

synonyms:uncertainty, doubt, lack of certainty, hesitation, vagueness; More

 

If I were a bird I'd fly in the clouds. I'm not a bird.

7 hours ago, GodsGrace said:

There are only two ways to go...

toward satan,

toward God.

 

If I forsake the way toward God and go toward satan...

I'm STILL SAVED?

 

Could you exegete the following please?

 

Colossians 1:22-23

 22yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach

23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel that you have heard, which was proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, was made a minister.

 

In the above verses Paul clearly states that we will be presented holy and blameless 

IF

we continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel heard.

You don't have to embrace the way to forsake it. A simply head knowledge saves no one.

 

Paul is assuming that they are saved, verse 22 is true of them if they persevere. It's not that verse 22 will stay in effect as long as they persevere 

 

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9 hours ago, Innerfire89 said:

Titus 1:1

1Paul, a servant of God and an apostle of Jesus Christ, for the sake of the faith of God’s elect and their knowledge of the truth, which accords with godliness.

 

Who would you say the elect are according to this verse?

 

Titus 1:3 says that Paul is now permitted to tell this good news to everyone...

so I'd have to say that the chosen are all those that have heard the word and accepted it....Jews AND Gentiles.

9 hours ago, Innerfire89 said:

if

/if/

Learn to pronounce

conjunction

1.

(introducing a conditional clause) on the condition or supposition that; in the event that.

"if you have a complaint, write to the director"

synonyms:on condition that, provided (that), providing (that), presuming (that), supposing (that), assuming (that), on the assumption that, allowing (that), as long as, given that, with the provision/proviso that, with/on the understanding that, if and only if, contingent on, in the event that, allowing that

"if the weather is fine, we can walk to the village"

2.

despite the possibility that; no matter whether.

"if it takes me seven years, I shall do it"

noun

1.

a condition or supposition.

"there are so many ifs and buts in the policy"

synonyms:uncertainty, doubt, lack of certainty, hesitation, vagueness; More

 

If I were a bird I'd fly in the clouds. I'm not a bird.

You don't have to embrace the way to forsake it. A simply head knowledge saves no one.

 

Paul is assuming that they are saved, verse 22 is true of them if they persevere. It's not that verse 22 will stay in effect as long as they persevere 

 

It's not the same as:  "IF I were a bird I'd fly in the clouds."

I do understand your point ... I just can't agree with it.

 

Peter is saying that IF a person goes back to being entangled....

That means that IT IS POSSIBLE for a person to get entangled in the world AGAIN.

 

I doesn't matter WHO it's speaking of or whether or not it happens...

The fact that Peter presents it as a possibility, means it COULD happen.

 

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On ‎3‎/‎30‎/‎2019 at 12:56 AM, Innerfire89 said:

To some it would seem that verses in second Peter  2 Peter 2 teach that salvation can be lost, but that's not the case.

 

1But false prophets also arose among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Master who bought them, bringing upon themselves swift destruction.

 

Peter first mentions the false prophets of the old testament who were also bought out of bondage with the rest of Israel, yet not all Israel is Israel, just as all Christians are not Christians.

 

 2And many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of truth will be blasphemed. 3And in their greed they will exploit you with false words. Their condemnation from long ago is not idle, and their destruction is not asleep.

4For if God did not spare angels when they sinned, but cast them into hell and committed them to chains of gloomy darkness to be kept until the judgment; 5if he did not spare the ancient world, but preserved Noah, a herald of righteousness, with seven others, when he brought a flood upon the world of the ungodly; 6if by turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah to ashes he condemned them to extinction, making them an example of what is going to happen to the ungodly; 7and if he rescued righteous Lot, greatly distressed by the sensual conduct of the wicked8(for as that righteous man lived among them day after day, he was tormenting his righteous soul over their lawless deeds that he saw and heard); 9then the Lord knows how to rescue the godly from trials, and to keep the unrighteous under punishment until the day of judgment, 

 

Now Peter assures that these false teachers will not go unpunished just as the false prophets of old.

 

Who is being rescued? And who the is the unrightieous being kept under punishment in verse 9?

God preserves the godly, His elect, He did it then and does it now with us and false teachers.

 

10and especially those who indulgee in the lust of defiling passion and despise authority.

Bold and willful, they do not tremble as they blaspheme the glorious ones, 11whereas angels, though greater in might and power, do not pronounce a blasphemous judgment against them before the Lord. 12But these, like irrational animals, creatures of instinct, born to be caught and destroyed, blaspheming about matters of which they are ignorant, will also be destroyed in their destruction,

 

Irrational animals, creatures of instinct, is that the nature Christian or one who has never been regenerated, never became a new creature in Christ, depraved as they've always been.

 

13suffering wrong as the wage for their wrongdoing. They count it pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are blots and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, while they feast with you. 14They have eyes full of adultery, insatiable for sin. They entice unsteady souls. They have hearts trained in greed. Accursed children! 

15Forsaking the right way, they have gone astray. They have followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved gain from wrongdoing, 16but was rebuked for his own transgression; a speechless donkey spoke with human voice and restrained the prophet’s madness.

17These are waterless springs and mists driven by a storm. For them the gloom of utter darkness has been reserved. 18For, speaking loud boasts of folly, they entice by sensual passions of the flesh those who are barely escaping from those who live in error. 19They promise them freedom, but they themselves are slaves of corruption. For whatever overcomes a person, to that he is enslaved. 20For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the last state has become worse for them than the first. 21For it would have been better for them never to have known the way of righteousness than after knowing it to turn back from the holy commandment delivered to them. 22What the true proverb says has happened to them: “The dog returns to its own vomit, and the sow, after washing herself, returns to wallow in the mire.”

 

That "if" in verse 20 is there for a reason, IF they had excaped the pollutions of the world. It's hypothetical, if it were so it would be worse.

In a few versions verse 22 starts with "but" and rightly so, if it were this way but it's like this.

The proverb is true of them, they are like dogs who return to thier vomit.

The nature of a dog is to return to it's vomit, but Christians take on a new nature.

If these false teachers were saved, then that would mean that all Christians are dogs who do the same.

" You cannot lose what you do not have " Words of Matthew Henry to a group of Methodist upon exiting a shared coach to London. Did Christ die in vain ? No, He suffered the cross for His elect and chosen people who were made righteous by giving them His Righteousness !  Once and for all !     M

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Psa 3:8  Salvation belongeth unto the LORD: thy blessing is upon thy people. Selah. 

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