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As I try and build my faith I inevitably end up trying to defend my faith against those that rely on the sciences as their ultimate source of authority. I often times try to answer as best I can but most of my education on these topics come from either my readings in Christian apologetics from Christian apologists or my memory from what I have learned in school (which isn’t much). The problem I have with the Christian apologetics readings is that they are essentially biased and to people I debate with, the content is very skewed and doesn’t prove any point because it is so biased. The problem though I have with this argument is that any other reading they are doing is also very biased as well. Someone was quoting a lot from Bill Nye, Dawkins and the like. I would like to start furthering my education in the sciences but it seems that anything I read will be biased. How could I go about this with an unbiased view? I mean I would like resources just to give me the blunt facts but they seem to not exist. 

 

This has been tough for me because now that I see how biased the material is that I have been reading I am starting to doubt all that I know in terms of why I believe the Christian faith... This isn’t to say that I proved Christianity to myself. That came from somewhere inside myself but the defenses definitely helped me “silence the devil” in a way. I am kinda in a whirlwind of thoughts right now and I feel stuck. 

 

Thanks in advance.

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1 hour ago, laverne3 said:

Someone was quoting a lot from Bill Nye, Dawkins and the like.

I realize that the people you mention are "science" leaning but if you don't mind I'd like to recommend a debate to you. Hitchens was an eloquent atheist compared to the militant atheist you mention:

 

 

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14 hours ago, William said:

I realize that the people you mention are "science" leaning but if you don't mind I'd like to recommend a debate to you. Hitchens was an eloquent atheist compared to the militant atheist you mention:

 

 

I did enjoy this. Thanks for sharing. It seems a lot of Hitchens arguments revolve around his idea of the cruelty of religion. There didn't seem to be a lot of reason behind what he believes but just some few things (usually falsified) that he clings on to. This seems to be a major theme amongst atheists and some agnostics.

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5 minutes ago, laverne3 said:

I did enjoy this. Thanks for sharing. It seems a lot of Hitchens arguments revolve around his idea of the cruelty of religion. There didn't seem to be a lot of reason behind what he believes but just some few things (usually falsified) that he clings on to. This seems to be a major theme amongst atheists and some agnostics.

If I might, suggest a book? It is titled Christian Apologetics by Cornelius Van Til. It is a very, very useful resource for learning the defense of the faith from a Biblical standpoint. I have found a wellspring of information and illustration in this book, and think it is perfectly suited for what you are asking for. 

 

God Bless!

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19 hours ago, Mjh29 said:

If I might, suggest a book? It is titled Christian Apologetics by Cornelius Van Til. It is a very, very useful resource for learning the defense of the faith from a Biblical standpoint. I have found a wellspring of information and illustration in this book, and think it is perfectly suited for what you are asking for. 

 

God Bless!

Great. I will check that out! thanks

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23 hours ago, Mjh29 said:

If I might, suggest a book? It is titled Christian Apologetics by Cornelius Van Til. It is a very, very useful resource for learning the defense of the faith from a Biblical standpoint. I have found a wellspring of information and illustration in this book, and think it is perfectly suited for what you are asking for. 

 

God Bless!

Correct me if wrong but Van Til is considered one of the best in presuppositional apologetics. From what I have read from Van Til and other presuppositional apologist, in my opinion, pressupptional apologetics is the most effective in bringing unbelievers into identifying why they object to the Gospel. Such apologetics don't really debate the facts but why one is even debating or struggling against the Gospel.

 

How would you sum up presuppositional apologetics?

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9 minutes ago, William said:

Correct me if wrong but Van Til is considered one of the best in presuppositional apologetics. From what I have read from Van Til and other presuppositional apologist, in my opinion, pressupptional apologetics is the most effective in bringing unbelievers into identifying why they object to the Gospel. Such apologetics don't really debate the facts but why one is even debating or struggling against the Gospel.

 

How would you sum up presuppositional apologetics?

Presuppositional Apologetics basically is recognizing that all facts come in a framework. So, when trying to debate, say, an atheist, we have to recognize that we cannot point to the facts as though they were self-evident; though they are for us, the atheist does not have the same frame of mind as we do, and therefore will interpret the facts radically differently than the Christian. It recognizes that, in order to show forth a good defense of the Word, we must  first show the opposition that they do indeed believe in something, because all men ultimately have faith in something. It then shows that, apart from an intelligent Creator, that no other explanation for our universe makes sense. 

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On 3/16/2019 at 1:33 PM, Mjh29 said:

Presuppositional Apologetics basically is recognizing that all facts come in a framework. So, when trying to debate, say, an atheist, we have to recognize that we cannot point to the facts as though they were self-evident; though they are for us, the atheist does not have the same frame of mind as we do, and therefore will interpret the facts radically differently than the Christian. It recognizes that, in order to show forth a good defense of the Word, we must  first show the opposition that they do indeed believe in something, because all men ultimately have faith in something. It then shows that, apart from an intelligent Creator, that no other explanation for our universe makes sense. 

There is also the obvious overlooked fact that the Christian's foundation for truth comes in the ear gate (God's Word), whereas that seems to be closed off with the natural man as they try to build their foundation through the eye-gate (observation). They demand a 'visible' God and if you can't provide visible proof, they aren't interested.

 

Yet...

 

Hebrews 11:3 KJV
[3] Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

 

God's Word coupled with His Spirit is the Great Apologist.

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Hello there,

 

I have appreciated the informative input in this thread, however my mind goes to 2 Timothy 2:15, where Timothy surrounded as he is there in Ephesus by argument and strife of words, is exhorted to study to show himself approved unto God, a workman which needed not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of Truth. Vain disputation can subvert the hearers, and destroy the faith of some.

 

In Christ Jesus

Our risen and glorified

Saviour, Lord and Head

Chris

 

 

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, C.Jord said:

Hello there,

 

I have appreciated the informative input in this thread, however my mind goes to 2 Timothy 2:15, where Timothy surrounded as he is there in Ephesus by argument and strife of words, is exhorted to study to show himself approved unto God, a workman which needed not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of Truth. Vain disputation can subvert the hearers, and destroy the faith of some.

 

In Christ Jesus

Our risen and glorified

Saviour, Lord and Head

Chris

 

 

 

8 hours ago, C.Jord said:

Hello there,

 

I have appreciated the informative input in this thread, however my mind goes to 2 Timothy 2:15, where Timothy surrounded as he is there in Ephesus by argument and strife of words, is exhorted to study to show himself approved unto God, a workman which needed not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of Truth. Vain disputation can subvert the hearers, and destroy the faith of some.

 

In Christ Jesus

Our risen and glorified

Saviour, Lord and Head

Chris

 

 

I'm failing to grasp the connection between 2Tim 2:15 which was written to Timothy regarding Church discipline (handling unruly behavior) and the OP which deals with ways to approach apologetics. Maybe you can clarify?

Edited by Solas

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, Solas said:

 

I'm failing to grasp the connection between 2Tim 2:15 which was written to Timothy regarding Church discipline (handling unruly behavior) and the OP which deals with ways to approach apologetics. Maybe you can clarify?

Hello @Solas,

 

Perhaps it does have little relation to the subject of the thread, however, the example of Timothy, being exhorted to rise above the arguments around him and seek to show himself approved unto God, by rightly dividing the Word of Truth, is a good one to keep in mind when endeavouring to make known the Truth of God's Word.  For it is so easy to get embroiled in argument and counter-argument which do not serve the truth. 

 

Thank you, Solas,

In Christ Jesus

our risen and glorified

Saviour, Lord and Head.

Chris 

 

 

Edited by C.Jord

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On 3/15/2019 at 5:29 AM, laverne3 said:

As I try and build my faith I inevitably end up trying to defend my faith against those that rely on the sciences as their ultimate source of authority. I often times try to answer as best I can but most of my education on these topics come from either my readings in Christian apologetics from Christian apologists or my memory from what I have learned in school (which isn’t much). The problem I have with the Christian apologetics readings is that they are essentially biased and to people I debate with, the content is very skewed and doesn’t prove any point because it is so biased. The problem though I have with this argument is that any other reading they are doing is also very biased as well. Someone was quoting a lot from Bill Nye, Dawkins and the like. I would like to start furthering my education in the sciences but it seems that anything I read will be biased. How could I go about this with an unbiased view? I mean I would like resources just to give me the blunt facts but they seem to not exist. 

 

This has been tough for me because now that I see how biased the material is that I have been reading I am starting to doubt all that I know in terms of why I believe the Christian faith... This isn’t to say that I proved Christianity to myself. That came from somewhere inside myself but the defenses definitely helped me “silence the devil” in a way. I am kinda in a whirlwind of thoughts right now and I feel stuck. 

 

Thanks in advance.

Hi Laverne, don't feel inferior when confronted with science, because scientists can only discover what God put here in the beginning.

You can't discover anything that was not here in the beginning it's impossible.

Everything that was made by God was from a place of invisibility, we are exactly the same, everything that you see also came from something unseen firstly, a thought.

With Love, Wnl

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