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Innerfire89

Are false teachers ever redeemed?

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I wasn't sure where I should put this exactly. But my question to you is, are false teachers ever redeemed?  It seems to me that the anwser is no, thier teaching of false gospels proves them to be non elect.

 

A few verse that make me think this.

2Peter 2:17

   17These are springs without water and mists driven by a storm, for whom the black darkness has been reserved.

 

Galatians 1:8

8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed.

 

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Might Paul be an example?

Aquilla and Priscilla?  

 

Rather than a blanket statement, we might look at each case.  

 

If a person is a false teacher and does not repent they are apparently not saved.

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37 minutes ago, GaoLu said:

Might Paul be an example?

Aquilla and Priscilla?  

 

Rather than a blanket statement, we might look at each case.  

 

If a person is a false teacher and does not repent they are apparently not saved.

Teachers of a false gospel.

 

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I think those that preach "a different gospel" have (1) "another Jesus" and (2) "a different spirit" (2 Corinthians 11:4).

 Since they have a different spirit and not the Holy Spirit they are not saved (Romans 8:9).

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12 hours ago, Innerfire89 said:

I wasn't sure where I should put this exactly. But my question to you is, are false teachers ever redeemed?  It seems to me that the anwser is no, thier teaching of false gospels proves them to be non elect.

 

A few verse that make me think this.

2Peter 2:17

   17These are springs without water and mists driven by a storm, for whom the black darkness has been reserved.

 

Galatians 1:8

8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed.

 

Plenty of cultic leaders and members have repented and been added to the flock?

 

Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormon's for starters.

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The Scriptures tell us if you dont know what you are talking about you are damned forever . ? 

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6 hours ago, Truth7t7 said:

Plenty of cultic leaders and members have repented and been added to the flock?

 

Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormon's for starters.

I don't know any of these people to know if that's true or not.

I'm more interested in what Scriputure says on the matter.

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3 hours ago, Becky said:

The Scriptures tell us if you dont know what you are talking about you are damned forever . ? 

I should have been more specific.

I'm talking about those that teach another gospel.

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I believe His grace covers a lot of dumb stuff when we ask. 

 

Act 8:22  Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee. 
1Jn 1:9  If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 
 

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5 hours ago, Becky said:

The Scriptures tell us if you dont know what you are talking about you are damned forever . ? 

Depends on how you convey the information. For example, how many times have we heard someone claim that the Holy Spirit (God) told them to tell us this or that? Are they not touching upon the office of prophet? How many times was a prophet in OT allowed false prophecy? 

 

I think a study which distinguishes between prophet and teacher might make for a fruitful discussion, but I'll chime in and suggest the main difference is between revelation and illumination. 

 

To what degree is blaspheming the Holy Spirit forgivable?

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5 hours ago, Innerfire89 said:

I should have been more specific.

I'm talking about those that teach another gospel.

 

  When I, by the grace of God, repented and turned to the Lord I was so ignorant of many things of the Bible. If someone asked me about believing in the Trinity and a whole host of other doctrines I would be simply dumbfounded as to how to correctly answer them. I think though if a person is a (true) believer the Lord through His Spirit will (in His time) reveal these truths to them. - May we be gentle with new believers in the faith.

 

 I think this is quite different from someone who has been reading the Bible for an extended period of time along with the fact that evidence for such doctrines of the Trinity have been presented to them and they respond by saying "No." If one is in a position of actually teaching the Bible the words of James 3:1 ought to be seriously considered before doing so.

 

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On ‎11‎/‎5‎/‎2018 at 5:15 PM, Innerfire89 said:

I wasn't sure where I should put this exactly. But my question to you is, are false teachers ever redeemed?  It seems to me that the anwser is no, thier teaching of false gospels proves them to be non elect.

 

A few verse that make me think this.

2Peter 2:17

   17These are springs without water and mists driven by a storm, for whom the black darkness has been reserved.

 

Galatians 1:8

8But even if we or an angel from heaven should preach to you a gospel contrary to the one we preached to you, let him be accursed.

 

No, false teachers cannot be redeemed because if they were they would , as all true believers do , have the indwelling Holy Spirit . They cannot teach light when they are possessed by darkness. And in them no truth dwells .

Edited by Matthew A.Duvall
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On ‎11‎/‎6‎/‎2018 at 5:32 AM, Truth7t7 said:

Plenty of cultic leaders and members have repented and been added to the flock?

 

Jehovah's Witnesses and Mormon's for starters.

Perhaps a few have repented and been added to the flock . But I doubt seriously if "plenty " have ever repented and been added to the flock. Then there is the genuineness of a true conversion  who are in question. Is their repentance all the work of the Holy Spirit ? Or did they just have a change of heart and " decided to become a Christian " . Like so many do .

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On ‎11‎/‎6‎/‎2018 at 2:20 AM, GaoLu said:

Might Paul be an example?

Aquilla and Priscilla?  

 

Rather than a blanket statement, we might look at each case.  

 

If a person is a false teacher and does not repent they are apparently not saved.

Paul's testimony never involved what he did to be reconciled to God. His testimony was what Christ did for him on the road to Damascus .

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7 hours ago, Matthew Duvall said:

No, false teachers cannot be redeemed because if they were they would , as all true believers do , have the indwelling Holy Spirit . They cannot teach light when they are possessed by darkness. And in them no truth dwells .

Although I wouldn't say they can't be redeemed, I'm leaning towards agreeing with you. I'm not seeing anything in Scriputure that indicates false teachers are ever redeemed.

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On 11/7/2018 at 11:43 PM, Innerfire89 said:

Although I wouldn't say they can't be redeemed, I'm leaning towards agreeing with you. I'm not seeing anything in Scriputure that indicates false teachers are ever redeemed.

It is very difficult to lead them to the foot of the cross, I've planted and watered but never reaped that crop.

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False teachers IMO, dont know God or they would not be teaching false doctrines.

Jesus told us to beware of false prophets, I view them as the same thing.

Unless God reveals to them the truth then they will remain captive to Satan's will.

If someone is captive to the devil's will, are those people saved?

Paul wrote about opponents to the grace of God who were captured by the devil, that it was up to God to grant repentance.

So if no repentance is granted, then there is no relationship with God is there, so then Christ will say to them, I never knew you.

Edited by sdowney717

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9 hours ago, Dave L said:

Are there any teachers that do not teach false doctrine in one area or another? Denominationalism suggests they do.

Of course there is truth and falsehood. However there is great depth in the scriptures. Sometimes one theological camp is truthful but not nearly as truthful or deep as another. For example we may read a verse and draw one understanding from the verse, but over time our understanding becomes more developed every time we come back around. Times that by hundreds of years or millenniums in the development of theology. This is called a hermeneutical circle. It is not necessarily that our first understanding was wrong but not nearly as comprehensive or insightful as later. 

 

As far as many denominations existing, they all break down into only a handful of essential soteriology. We have a soteriology category which covers every denominational camp. 

 

https://www.christforums.org/forum/54-soteriology-and-reformation-theology/

 

God bless,

William 

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2 hours ago, William said:

Of course there is truth and falsehood. However there is great depth in the scriptures. Sometimes one theological camp is truthful but not nearly as truthful or deep as another. For example we may read a verse and draw one understanding from the verse, but over time our understanding becomes more developed every time we come back around. Times that by hundreds of years or millenniums in the development of theology. This is called a hermeneutical circle. It is not necessarily that our first understanding was wrong but not nearly as comprehensive or insightful as later. 

 

As far as many denominations existing, they all break down into only a handful of essential soteriology. We have a soteriology category which covers every denominational camp. 

 

https://www.christforums.org/forum/54-soteriology-and-reformation-theology/

 

God bless,

William 

There will always be areas of disagreement over doctrine, but this does not make someone a false teacher. God's promise is those He love He chastises and He disciplines everyone whom He receives, so they will be corrected eventually one way or another about errors by Him else they would not be the children of God. False teachers teach destructive heresies.

 

2 Peter 2 

[ Destructive Doctrines ] But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction does not slumber. ...

2 hours ago, William said:

Of course there is truth and falsehood. However there is great depth in the scriptures. Sometimes one theological camp is truthful but not nearly as truthful or deep as another. For example we may read a verse and draw one understanding from the verse, but over time our understanding becomes more developed every time we come back around. Times that by hundreds of years or millenniums in the development of theology. This is called a hermeneutical circle. It is not necessarily that our first understanding was wrong but not nearly as comprehensive or insightful as later. 

 

As far as many denominations existing, they all break down into only a handful of essential soteriology. We have a soteriology category which covers every denominational camp. 

 

https://www.christforums.org/forum/54-soteriology-and-reformation-theology/

 

God bless,

William 

There will always be areas of disagreement over doctrine, but this does not make someone a false teacher. God's promise is those He love He chastises and He disciplines everyone whom He receives, so they will be corrected eventually one way or another about errors by Him else they would not be the children of God. False teachers teach destructive heresies.

 

2 Peter 2 

[ Destructive Doctrines ] But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction does not slumber. ...

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3 minutes ago, sdowney717 said:

There will always be areas of disagreement over doctrine, but this does not make someone a false teacher. God's promise is those He love He chastises and He disciplines everyone whom He receives, so they will be corrected eventually one way or another about errors by Him else they would not be the children of God. False teachers teach destructive heresies.

 

2 Peter 2 

[ Destructive Doctrines ] But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction does not slumber. ...

There will always be areas of disagreement over doctrine, but this does not make someone a false teacher. God's promise is those He love He chastises and He disciplines everyone whom He receives, so they will be corrected eventually one way or another about errors by Him else they would not be the children of God. False teachers teach destructive heresies.

 

2 Peter 2 

[ Destructive Doctrines ] But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them, and bring on themselves swift destruction. And many will follow their destructive ways, because of whom the way of truth will be blasphemed. By covetousness they will exploit you with deceptive words; for a long time their judgment has not been idle, and their destruction does not slumber. ...

I agree. Contention towards orthodox doctrine separates the wheat from tares and the sheep from goats. Here's a thread you may be interested in. Let us strive towards truth in Christian love:

 

God bless,

William

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On 11/6/2018 at 9:26 AM, Becky said:

I believe His grace covers a lot of dumb stuff when we ask. 

 

Act 8:22  Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee. 
1Jn 1:9  If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 
 

So succinctly stated.

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1 minute ago, islandrazor said:

So succinctly stated.

It is God who grants repentance to know the truth.

God deals with us as His children, and that relationship never changes.

Once you are born again, you are Hi blood bought possession, your spirit is joined as one spirit with HIM. He owns you.

 

Ephesians 1
13 In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise,

14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.

13 minutes ago, William said:

I agree. Contention towards orthodox doctrine separates the wheat from tares and the sheep from goats. Here's a thread you may be interested in. Let us strive towards truth in Christian love:

 

God bless,

William

Yes, God has ordained this to be so, according to His will. We are to be careful of our doctrine, when Christ spoke to be wary of the doctrine of the pharisees, he knew such false teaching has a certain seductive quality about it. Satan is the tempter and Satan knows how to speak well.

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24 minutes ago, sdowney717 said:

It is God who grants repentance to know the truth.

Amen!

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