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Frosty

How many are going to heaven?

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Frosty

Some say that there will only be a few,  some say that there will be many.  King David got reprimanded by God for numbering Israel. .  

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Frosty
3 minutes ago, Hitch said:

All the  Father has given.

That is a good safe answer, but it still leaves my question of few or more unanswered.

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Frosty
11 minutes ago, Hitch said:

OK How many stars are there ?

 

I understand, by your question, that you are leaning toward - Many, is that correct?  Same as the grains in the seashore.

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Hitch

You know what the Scripture says, just as you know it is ambiguous on this point, so what it is you're really asking ?

 

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Frosty
1 minute ago, Hitch said:

You know what the Scripture says, just as you know it is ambiguous on this point, so what it is you're really asking ?

 

Let me ask in a different way.  What is your interpretation of the two gates mentioned in Matt 7:13-14?

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Hitch

I reckon that passage has general  ,but limited application, as it is chiefly concerned with our Lord's contemporary generation  of  Israel.

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Frosty
2 minutes ago, Hitch said:

I reckon that passage has general  ,but limited application, as it is chiefly concerned with our Lord's contemporary generation  of  Israel.

I honestly do not comprehend what your comments mean, without further explanation.

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Hitch

Hmmmm  It seems  Christ was ( primarily)  speaking about  about  the men of  Israel who would recognize and follow  him.  Does that help ?

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Frosty
22 minutes ago, Hitch said:

Hmmmm  It seems  Christ was ( primarily)  speaking about  about  the men of  Israel who would recognize and follow  him.  Does that help ?

I get your drift Hitch.  Why did you even bother to post?

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Hitch

I believe this forum has a block feature. No one will force you to read or respond to anything  Ive posted

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Matthew A.Duvall
6 hours ago, Frosty said:

Some say that there will only be a few,  some say that there will be many.  King David got reprimanded by God for numbering Israel. .  

The reason David numbered Israel is because he wanted to know the number of people who welded the sword and could depended upon if he were forced to go to war with any ungodly enemy forces that were near the boarders of Israel and posed a threat to the safety of his people. God was displeased because David should have known that God was Omnipotent , Omniscience , Omnipresent and Immutable and did not rely on the number of people who could go to war in defense of Israel. If God wanted to give the victory to Israel, which He did on many occasions , the number of warriors was immaterial .   M

 

 

 

 

6 hours ago, Frosty said:

I understand, by your question, that you are leaning toward - Many, is that correct?  Same as the grains in the seashore.

Many is incorrect . Read Rom. 8:1 - 9 : 29      M

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Frosty
9 hours ago, Matthew Duvall said:

The reason David numbered Israel is because he wanted to know the number of people who welded the sword and could depended upon if he were forced to go to war with any ungodly enemy forces that were near the boarders of Israel and posed a threat to the safety of his people. God was displeased because David should have known that God was Omnipotent , Omniscience , Omnipresent and Immutable and did not rely on the number of people who could go to war in defense of Israel. If God wanted to give the victory to Israel, which He did on many occasions , the number of warriors was immaterial .   M

 

 

 

 

Many is incorrect . Read Rom. 8:1 - 9 : 29      M

Could you elaborate on your scripture texts, I am not seeing your implication to "a few"?

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Becky
Moderator

Rev 19:5  And a voice came out of the throne, saying, Praise our God, all ye his servants, and ye that fear him, both small and great. 
Rev 19:6  And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth. 

 

Rev 7:9  After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; 
 

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Frosty
1 hour ago, Becky said:

Rev 19:5  And a voice came out of the throne, saying, Praise our God, all ye his servants, and ye that fear him, both small and great. 
Rev 19:6  And I heard as it were the voice of a great multitude, and as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of mighty thunderings, saying, Alleluia: for the Lord God omnipotent reigneth. 

 

Rev 7:9  After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; 
 

We can not know for sure, but I believe there are far many more that are going to heaven than there are that are going to hell.  Just curious, what is your take on the two gates talked about in Matt 7:13-14? 

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Becky
Moderator

Sermon on the Mount

 

Mat 5:1  And seeing the multitudes, he went up into a mountain: and when he was set, his disciples came unto him: 
Mat 5:2  And he opened his mouth, and taught them, saying, 

 

There is A LOT of preaching between 5 and 8 

 

Mat 7:12  Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets. 
Mat 7:13  Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 
Mat 7:14  Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. 


In those time most cities had walls around them so they had gates.  The picture in my mind is of a pretty, kinda ornate gate,welcoming travelers to the city. The other is what we might call a service gate. . I picture this thinking those who Jesus was talking too knew of those gates and would understand the simple example.


 

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Becky
Moderator

We ol humans can not grasp totally His Mercy and Grace ... We try we make stabs at it. God sent His Son to the Cross. I have a son i can not picture myself sacrificing him for some one else . 

 

Amazing Grace, How sweet the sound
That saved a wretch like me
I once was lost, but now am found
T'was blind but now I see

T'was Grace that taught my heart to fear
And Grace, my fears relieved
How precious did that grace appear
The hour I first believed

Through many dangers, toils and snares
We have already come.
T'was grace that brought us safe thus far
And grace will lead us home,
And grace will lead us home

Amazing grace, Howe Sweet the sound
That saved a wretch like me
I once was lost but now am found
T'was blind but now I see

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Frosty
14 minutes ago, Becky said:

Sermon on the Mount

 

Mat 5:1  And seeing the multitudes, he went up into a mountain: and when he was set, his disciples came unto him: 
Mat 5:2  And he opened his mouth, and taught them, saying, 

 

There is A LOT of preaching between 5 and 8 

 

Mat 7:12  Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets. 
Mat 7:13  Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: 
Mat 7:14  Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. 


In those time most cities had walls around them so they had gates.  The picture in my mind is of a pretty, kinda ornate gate,welcoming travelers to the city. The other is what we might call a service gate. . I picture this thinking those who Jesus was talking too knew of those gates and would understand the simple example.


 

Some people look at the two gates and think that the strait gate and the narrow way that leads to life is talking about those that are going to heaven, and arrive at only a few going to heaven.  I believe that the people that go in both gates are regenerated children of God.  those children of God that go into the wide gate are many and the destruction they receive is because they are teaching and preaching false doctrines, most commonly, eternal salvation by the works of man.  Those that go into the strait gate, after diligently seeking, find it, and they are few.  What they found, with the revelation of the Holy Spirit, is the truth of Jesus's doctrine and the life that leads to is Christ's visible church.  I believe the scriptures teach that there is a visible church (which is the one that is preaching the truth of Jesus's doctrine) and an invisible church which comprises those that enter both gates.  The old testament references it to 'a wheel within a wheel".    

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Hitch
7 hours ago, Frosty said:

We can not know for sure, but I believe there are far many more that are going to heaven than there are that are going to hell.  Just curious, what is your take on the two gates talked about in Matt 7:13-14

Nice thought. Sometimes  I think so .

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Matthew A.Duvall
12 hours ago, Frosty said:

Could you elaborate on your scripture texts, I am not seeing your implication to "a few"?

Actually this was misinterpreted by a member who thought that David was numbering the genuine Hebrew believers in Israel. He should have read any bible notes that would have clearly spelled out the fact that David meant no such thing . The emphasis here had to do with warm bodies that were available for the service of the king .

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Matthew A.Duvall
6 hours ago, Frosty said:

Some people look at the two gates and think that the strait gate and the narrow way that leads to life is talking about those that are going to heaven, and arrive at only a few going to heaven.  I believe that the people that go in both gates are regenerated children of God.  those children of God that go into the wide gate are many and the destruction they receive is because they are teaching and preaching false doctrines, most commonly, eternal salvation by the works of man.  Those that go into the strait gate, after diligently seeking, find it, and they are few.  What they found, with the revelation of the Holy Spirit, is the truth of Jesus's doctrine and the life that leads to is Christ's visible church.  I believe the scriptures teach that there is a visible church (which is the one that is preaching the truth of Jesus's doctrine) and an invisible church which comprises those that enter both gates.  The old testament references it to 'a wheel within a wheel".    

The scripture doesn't teach that there will be no unredeemed people based on what you're saying in regards to both kinds of people entering the gate of their choice and ending up in Heaven . It is clear from what Jesus is saying in answer to Peter concerning the number of redeemed people being so few . He asked. " Lord are there few that be saved ? "  Jesus answers with a metaphor concerning the wide gate and the narrow gate . Jesus replies , " for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many that go therein. " The wide gate implies man's useless efforts to please God , yet hold on to sin and in the end enter into Heaven . That's secular humanism thinking . He continues, " because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life and there are few who find it . "   It all gets down to the Christian life in general . It is difficult in that believers are faced with many difficult task in their high calling . The world in general is perfectly content in their horrible belief that they can please an Omnipotent God and still enter into His presence in the end .

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discipler77
On 10/1/2018 at 5:56 AM, Frosty said:

How many are going to heaven?

 

Some say that there will only be a few,  some say that there will be many.  King David got reprimanded by God for numbering Israel. .  

ROMANS.10: = 6 But the righteousness of faith speaks in this way, “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ down from above) 7 or, “ ‘Who will descend into the abyss?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead).

 

8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith which we preach): 9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

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Frosty
10 hours ago, Matthew Duvall said:

Actually this was misinterpreted by a member who thought that David was numbering the genuine Hebrew believers in Israel. He should have read any bible notes that would have clearly spelled out the fact that David meant no such thing . The emphasis here had to do with warm bodies that were available for the service of the king .

 

3 hours ago, discipler77 said:

ROMANS.10: = 6 But the righteousness of faith speaks in this way, “Do not say in your heart, ‘Who will ascend into heaven?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ down from above) 7 or, “ ‘Who will descend into the abyss?’ ” (that is, to bring Christ up from the dead).

 

8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith which we preach): 9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.

I believe the scriptures to teach that those that Jesus died for were at that time saved eternally in "a covenant relationship" and are saved eternally in "a personal relationship" as described in Eph 2 especially in verse 5, while the natural man, described in 1 Cor 2:14, was "yet dead in sins" having no ability to "confess with his mouth" or "believe in his heart".  Salvation, according to Strong's Greek meaning, is "a deliverance".  After we have been regenerated, we can be "delivered-saved" here in time, by confessing with our mouth and believing in our heart that God has raised Jesus from the dead.  Israel is "a type" of the elect.  God changed Jacob's name to be called Israel in Gen 32:28.  Sometimes in the scriptures that mention Israel, it is actually talking about Jacob.  This fact eliminates the possibility of man having a part in his eternal salvation, and gives God praise for delivering us eternally by his grace, without the help of man.  

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Frosty
10 hours ago, Matthew Duvall said:

The scripture doesn't teach that there will be no unredeemed people based on what you're saying in regards to both kinds of people entering the gate of their choice and ending up in Heaven . It is clear from what Jesus is saying in answer to Peter concerning the number of redeemed people being so few . He asked. " Lord are there few that be saved ? "  Jesus answers with a metaphor concerning the wide gate and the narrow gate . Jesus replies , " for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many that go therein. " The wide gate implies man's useless efforts to please God , yet hold on to sin and in the end enter into Heaven . That's secular humanism thinking . He continues, " because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life and there are few who find it . "   It all gets down to the Christian life in general . It is difficult in that believers are faced with many difficult task in their high calling . The world in general is perfectly content in their horrible belief that they can please an Omnipotent God and still enter into His presence in the end .

I did not say that all mankind entered the two gates.  I said "those that have been regenerated" inter both gates.  There are still many that are but natural men, as described in 1 Cor 2:14, that do not enter either gate.  There is only one true doctrine of Jesus, but there are many false doctrines that are taught and preached.

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