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John Calvin puts forward a very simple reason why love is the greatest gift: “Because faith and hope are our own: love is diffused among others.” In other words, faith and hope benefit the possessor, but love always benefits another. In John 13:34–35 Jesus says, “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.” Love always requires an “other” as an object; love cannot remain within itself, and that is part of what makes love the greatest gift.
El Dalto

Hell/Hades, The 1000 year reign, and the second death

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Im wanting more information on these topics, I don't go to church but I listen to sermons online for discernment reasons. It's hard to get good answers on these sorts of things. One of my big questions is about Hell, the current holding place for sinners without repentance. I listened to Bryan W. Melvin's testimony and I'm wondering how Biblically sound it is, mainly if it goes against doctrine? If someone who believes in Christ, but does not repent and continues to willfully sin is sent to Hell, will that person be destined to die spiritually in the lake of fire or will Hell be a spiritual cleansing/punishment to purify the soul (the ones who accept Jesus as the Son of Elohim)? Does the 1000 years of Heaven on Earth last a literal 1000 years? Will people live and die, or do the continue to live until the final rebellion and into eternity? Thanks for taking the time out to help me further understand, if you can post Scripture from multiple sources to back up your information that would be great. I just don't accept peoples opinions on the matter without the Word of Elohim. I will accept the Book of Enoch if there is a Scripture that is relevant. 

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Staff

Hi El Dalto,

 

Welcome to Christforums!

 

You are actually posting in the wrong forum but you'd be better off posting in the Eschatology section:

 

https://www.christforums.org/forum/20-christian-eschatology/

 

Take a peek in that category and the sub-forums which result in two theological perspectives.

 

As for the book of Enoch, your question as to whether it should be considered as equal to actual Scripture ought be asked here:

 

https://www.christforums.org/forum/58-bible-inspiration-and-translations/

 

God bless,

William

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4 minutes ago, William said:

Hi El Dalto,

 

Welcome to Christforums!

 

You are actually posting in the wrong forum but you'd be better off posting in the Eschatology section:

 

https://www.christforums.org/forum/20-christian-eschatology/

 

Take a peek in that category and the sub-forums which result in two theological perspectives.

 

As for the book of Enoch, your question as to whether it should be considered as equal to actual Scripture ought be asked here:

 

https://www.christforums.org/forum/58-bible-inspiration-and-translations/

 

God bless,

William

Thank you 

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On ‎9‎/‎15‎/‎2018 at 10:11 PM, El Dalto said:

Im wanting more information on these topics, I don't go to church but I listen to sermons online for discernment reasons. It's hard to get good answers on these sorts of things. One of my big questions is about Hell, the current holding place for sinners without repentance. I listened to Bryan W. Melvin's testimony and I'm wondering how Biblically sound it is, mainly if it goes against doctrine? If someone who believes in Christ, but does not repent and continues to willfully sin is sent to Hell, will that person be destined to die spiritually in the lake of fire or will Hell be a spiritual cleansing/punishment to purify the soul (the ones who accept Jesus as the Son of Elohim)? Does the 1000 years of Heaven on Earth last a literal 1000 years? Will people live and die, or do the continue to live until the final rebellion and into eternity? Thanks for taking the time out to help me further understand, if you can post Scripture from multiple sources to back up your information that would be great. I just don't accept peoples opinions on the matter without the Word of Elohim. I will accept the Book of Enoch if there is a Scripture that is relevant. 

Hi El Dalto,

 I think I can help you with two of these things mentioned above . First of all Hell does not exist at this present time . Hell will be the final eternal abode of the unrepentant  sinners after they are judged by God . When an unrepentant sinner dies they die in their sins and will ultimately be judged [ by their sins ] . Repentance is not  possible once a sinner dies . They will be remanded to Hades , once known as Abraham's Bosom   where they will suffer unrelenting  torments and misery and remain in their unforgiven state waiting to be judged [  by their sins ] .

Jesus usually spoke in metaphors , but not when telling about the fate of the unbelieving after death . Lk. 16: 19 ff . It is reasonably understood that Jesus was relating an actual event since He mentions people by name. But  in His metaphors He doesn't . Hence, Lazarus ! 

He tells of a certain beggar named Lazarus who lived off of crumbs dropped from a rich man's table. Lazarus died and entered Abraham's Bosom in Hades. The rich man also died and entered into Hades where he was exposed to torments and misery , desiring a drop of water just to wet his dry tongue . There was a ' Great Gulf Fixed ' between where they were . They could both see and hear each other , but could not pass across the unpassable gulf that held  both in their temporal state . Lazarus in his redeemed state while the rich man was still in his sins awaiting the Day of Judgment . The rich man called out to Abraham seeking mercy ,but receiving none. He then asked Abraham to send Lazarus to five of his brothers to tell them of his present torments and warn them to repent or they too will enter into this place of torments . But Abraham reminded him that if they did not believe the prophets , how could they believe one coming back from the dead !

Hades still exist and the unrepentant sinners still suffer in their miseries . However  since the death and resurrection of Christ  actually entering Hades to announce His victory over sin and Satan , all redeemed persons were immediately resurrected into heaven. Prior to this Paul tells us that " corruption had to put on incorruption " . read 1st.Cor.15:42 ff . So when a saved person dies, they immediately enter into heaven . The unsaved are still in Hades and will remain there until the Great White Throne Judgment . note; I am trying to shorten scripture quotes in order to save space .

Now about Hell . There will be no literal fires in Hell . If God judges the sins of the positional unrepentant sinner by

" Hell fire " then it is reasonably understood that there will be no eternal suffering for sins. The sinner will simply no longer exist. The present state of the sinner is that they are held in their sins and will be judged by their sins . Judged [ by their sins ] Sins are in the conscience . But the sinner is not aware of it because he has never reconciled them by even the slightest thought of their existence . Hell will be a complete and unchangeable mental bread down where the conscience is opened ,that was once active to the mental state , reverting to  the Hidden Sovereignty of God for leaving one in their sins . All reasoning is vacated and the conscience is opened by God , never to be closed again . What is left is when one fully understands and gives their full attention to a sin filled state of remorse ,guilt ,sorrow and regrets . The sinner cannot understand this right now , but when they are judged they will . To the fullest understanding of mental anguish . The guilt will control the mental state that can never be forgotten or repented of . God will not allow one whom He has decided to leave in their sins to repent of them and escape the eternal torments of Hell . Consignment to Hell is forever ! There will be no fires in Hell. Jesus mentions the reality of Outer Darkness where there will be crying and gnashing of teeth. When one enters Hell there will be darkness that defies definition. The eternal state of being tormented and tortured by the sinners own sins . The mental anguish will be so great and so hopeless that the opened conscience will not allow for the slightest imagination of any thing pleasant that has ever happened to them .The opened conscience will only disclose sins to them through the opened and guilt ridden conscience .  

Simply put , the sinner is not aware of his lost condition and the pending wrath of God that has yet to be experienced at the Judgment Seat of Christ .

 

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On ‎9‎/‎15‎/‎2018 at 10:11 PM, El Dalto said:

 I listened to Bryan W. Melvin's testimony and I'm wondering how Biblically sound it is,

What is this person's background and what is this testimony he gives ? Not one of these " I went to heaven and saw the Lord " things ,I hope.

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