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John Calvin puts forward a very simple reason why love is the greatest gift: “Because faith and hope are our own: love is diffused among others.” In other words, faith and hope benefit the possessor, but love always benefits another. In John 13:34–35 Jesus says, “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.” Love always requires an “other” as an object; love cannot remain within itself, and that is part of what makes love the greatest gift.
Chris1234

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I believe my mental health symptoms are improving, either due to prayer or a new medication, or both. But my water is scheduled to be disconnected tomorrow, and it looks like some family members, including my young son!, will be loaning me the ninety or so dollars to keep it on. (I didn't tell him what the money is going to be used for.). I get so mad at God- the all powerful being who seems so very, very distant most of the time.

 

My job has dramatically cut my hours. It always seems that the needs of the company ("the man" or the boss) overshadow the needs of its employees. The "higher ups" earn three times or more than the employees "in the trenches." Enough is enough!

 

And finally, does anyone here believe Christians are persecuted more than others are? What I am referring to is not persecution due to obvious good that Christians do that the World consciously persecutes. And of course there is the perceived persecution when God is molding us, and the actual persecution when (God allows) Satan to persecute us.

 

No, what I am referring to is unconscious persecution from "principalities." I feel the evil in others can sometimes sense the God in me, Thus, I get ridiculed, abandoned, singled out, hurt, etc. more than non-Christians. 

 

Please pray for my son Noah, who turns 13 today. He has anxiety that is called PANDAS. Please pray for me and my mental illnesses and my finances, and please address what I wrote above, especially my question about unconscious persecution from others. Thank you.

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Firstly, welcome to Christforums.

 

There is never a just reason to be angry at God. He owes us nothing, yet gives us grace and mercy beyond our understanding.

He guides our lives for our own good, even when life seems unbearable.

 

Higher positions at work pay more. Now I'm not saying that they all treat the empolee under them right, but they of course they will make more. What kind of place is it that you're working?

 

I'm kinda a peculiar person myself, it not uncommon for me to get dirty looks from people or have people talk down to me or out right ignore sometimes. But I couldn't care less, they're all a bunch of clowns, rats runing an endless race. Could it be that you're just weird? Don't take that the wrong way, but could it be that they're not really sensing The Holy Spirit in you but that they just find you weird?  That's what people do when they see someone a little different, they treat you like they're offended that you would breath the same air as them.

 

Saying a prayer for you and your son.

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2 hours ago, Chris1234 said:

I believe my mental health symptoms are improving, either due to prayer or a new medication, or both. But my water is scheduled to be disconnected tomorrow, and it looks like some family members, including my young son!, will be loaning me the ninety or so dollars to keep it on. (I didn't tell him what the money is going to be used for.). I get so mad at God- the all powerful being who seems so very, very distant most of the time.

 

My job has dramatically cut my hours. It always seems that the needs of the company ("the man" or the boss) overshadow the needs of its employees. The "higher ups" earn three times or more than the employees "in the trenches." Enough is enough!

 

And finally, does anyone here believe Christians are persecuted more than others are? What I am referring to is not persecution due to obvious good that Christians do that the World consciously persecutes. And of course there is the perceived persecution when God is molding us, and the actual persecution when (God allows) Satan to persecute us.

 

No, what I am referring to is unconscious persecution from "principalities." I feel the evil in others can sometimes sense the God in me, Thus, I get ridiculed, abandoned, singled out, hurt, etc. more than non-Christians. 

 

Please pray for my son Noah, who turns 13 today. He has anxiety that is called PANDAS. Please pray for me and my mental illnesses and my finances, and please address what I wrote above, especially my question about unconscious persecution from others. Thank you.

Hi Chris1234, I see that you joined here 13th August 2017 and have made 7 posts. I read some of your material from a year ago to get a better idea of your circumstances and what might be your particular cross to bear

Mat 16:24
(24)  Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.


The cross which Christ had to bear was both the instrument of His death and the means of our salvation. When we deny ourselves and take up our cross we give up our own will and accept God's Will, following the example of our Lord Jesus Christ. This dying-to-serve-self and living-to-serve-God is rewarded in eternity and Paul instructs us not to faint because we have something far better in store for us, and not to focus on the things of this life but on the things yet to come in the next life. 

 

2Co 4:7-18
(7)  But we have this treasure in earthen vessels, that the excellency of the power may be of God, and not of us.
(8)  We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair;
(9)  Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed;
(10)  Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body.
(11)  For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus' sake, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh.
(12)  So then death works in us, but life in you.
(13)  We having the same spirit of faith, according as it is written, I believed, and therefore have I spoken; we also believe, and therefore speak;
(14)  Knowing that he which raised up the Lord Jesus shall raise up us also by Jesus, and shall present us with you.
(15)  For all things are for your sakes, that the abundant grace might through the thanksgiving of many redound to the glory of God.
(16)  For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.
(17)  For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, works for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory;

(18)  While we look not at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.

 

I pray that you and your son will make it your business to love the Lord your God with all your heart and soul and strength and mind, because all, absolutely all things work together for good for those who love God and are the called according to His purpose.

 

Blessings in the love of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Edited by Placable37
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Innerfire89,

 

I disagree. The following is not meant to hurt your feelings, but it's strongly worded.

 

God throws us out into this broken world, knows we will sin, tells us we must beg for forgiveness when we sin (and we have no choice to not sin), and He owes us nothing? If anything, He should ask us for forgiveness. 

 

If I forced you into an environment in which you had no choice but to fail, would you be angry with me, or would you ask me to forgive you?

 

So I believe I have a very just right to be angry with God. I was taught it's OK to be angry with Him, but its not OK to not talk to him about it. Just like in a marriage.

 

Sure Im weird. And who created me? So I have God to thank? for making me weird. That makes zero sense. 

 

And I would argue that by you not speaking up when people chastise you, that makes it easier for them to chastise me later on when I cross paths with them. Jesus called nobody a clown. He rebuked them.

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God has every right to put us in whatever situation He puts us in.

We sin not only by nature but by free will.

There is no injustice with God and He is the judge, not you. All that God does is correct, it's impossible for God to do wrong. 

 

God owes us nothing, we sinned against Him, you're not even capable of asking for forgiveness of your sins without God inabling you. God came down out of heaven to die in the place of sinners who hated Him, He gave us the opposite of what we deserve. There is nothing any person can do but thank God that they have even the slightest of enjoyment in life, what more than those who are given eternal life?

 

 

 

So what if you were taught something false?

 

Why should I cry about such a minor offence? People are jerks, that's life, mature people can deal with it.

And who are those people that I should care what they think? They are clowns, thier opinions mean nothing.

 

How likely is it that the same exact people that I've met would cross paths with?  And do you go around rebuking everyone who is stuck up?

 

Your whole problem starts with how you think about God, who is perfectly Holy and perfectly just.

It is absurdly prideful for you to think that you can judge God. 

 

 

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On ‎9‎/‎9‎/‎2018 at 10:24 PM, Chris1234 said:

I believe my mental health symptoms are improving, either due to prayer or a new medication, or both. But my water is scheduled to be disconnected tomorrow, and it looks like some family members, including my young son!, will be loaning me the ninety or so dollars to keep it on. (I didn't tell him what the money is going to be used for.). I get so mad at God- the all powerful being who seems so very, very distant most of the time.

 

My job has dramatically cut my hours. It always seems that the needs of the company ("the man" or the boss) overshadow the needs of its employees. The "higher ups" earn three times or more than the employees "in the trenches." Enough is enough!

 

And finally, does anyone here believe Christians are persecuted more than others are? What I am referring to is not persecution due to obvious good that Christians do that the World consciously persecutes. And of course there is the perceived persecution when God is molding us, and the actual persecution when (God allows) Satan to persecute us.

 

No, what I am referring to is unconscious persecution from "principalities." I feel the evil in others can sometimes sense the God in me, Thus, I get ridiculed, abandoned, singled out, hurt, etc. more than non-Christians. 

 

Please pray for my son Noah, who turns 13 today. He has anxiety that is called PANDAS. Please pray for me and my mental illnesses and my finances, and please address what I wrote above, especially my question about unconscious persecution from others. Thank you.

Yes, you and your family will be included in my prayers . Don't feel that you're going through something that others before you have never experienced . Once we enter God's Kingdom we have to expect to undergo many things the world can only look at with contempt and hubris narcissism . It's the true believers that must contend with it . And never doubt that Satan will be at your side listening to God blessing you while he is accusing you before the Throne of our God.  It's to be expected .  M

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16 hours ago, Chris1234 said:

So I believe I have a very just right to be angry with God. I was taught it's OK to be angry with Him, but its not OK to not talk to him about it. Just like in a marriage.

 

Well chris, I have been through much the same as you. While in the mission field seemingly going about God's business, God let my health fail on about 6 different fronts. I had to take a medical leave to get three immediate surgeries done. While on leave I was terminated. This was the SF Bay area, and without the job I could not stay in the mission work, which God had meanwhile dried up. 

 

My only choice was to leave the area as rent was too high to stay there. I moved to Arkansas and stayed with family. I still have many of the health problems so I got on disability. For the next 25 years God would not let me start so much as a Bible study. I am coming back into my ministry by writing books on what God has shown me. I will soon publish my second. This side of glory, we may not get answers to why God worked as such in our lives. Yes, I was angry with God for a while and somewhat bitter but we just have to play out the hand we were dealt. God is preparing me for something and all a man can do is wait on the Lord.   :RpS_thumbup:

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Thank you, Matthew and deade. (Matthew: I realize I am not the only one to experience the pain that I have experienced, but that alone does not make the 'suffering' or the pain any less powerful.).

 

Innerfire89, I don't wish to get into a heated or nasty debate with you. Again, the following is strongly worded but is not meant to hurt your feelings.

 

You did not address the specifics of my post. With all due respect, though I know you are not, you come across almost as an automaton or religious robot, incapable of having your own opinion and afraid to upset God with overly pious, obsequious fawning toward Him. These are real problems, real people, not "clowns" that we must deal with. If someone comes to you hungry, for example, Jesus would probably want you to give them food, not words about how they need to be less prideful. This world is real and requires practical solutions, not theological arguments. 

 

And by the way, referring to them as "clowns" contradicts your own strong belief in the body of Christ: you are seemingly insulting Him by referring to one of His creatures as a clown. 

 

I didn't mean that I would cross paths with the specific people that you ignore and later refer to as a clown. I meant you, along with the countless others that do as you do, make it more difficult for those like me who grow tired of others' innane, mean, selfish behavior. Just today, I was in the library sitting next to a young lady of about 18 years old who obviously "did not know better." I was trying to complete a job application (probably Job # 50 or 60 of my life, thanks to mental health issues). She was on 'speaker phone' with a friend who was using obscenities. Of course, the library staff were nowhere to be found, so I politely asked her to go outside with her conversation, which she did. I could have chosen to think "Boy, she sure is a clown," and then left. But how else will she learn the rules of the world (library, in this case). Obviously, her parents did not teach her. And next time she is in the library, she may be less likely to offend one of your children, or just children in general, etc. 

 

Please address these specifics: God throws us out into this broken world, knows we will sin, tells us we must beg for forgiveness when we sin (and we have no choice to not sin), and He owes us nothing? If anything, He should ask us for forgiveness. 

 

If I forced you into an environment in which you had no choice but to fail, would you be angry with me, or would you ask me to forgive you? If I forced into the boundaries of a football game for a lifetime and being a football player was the life you were destined to live, but I gave you no arms and no legs, how would you feel? And what if when you complained to me, I told you that you were being overly prideful and that you should ask me for forgiveness for your shortcomings. Would you ask me for forgiveness? I really don't think so. 

 

If God or Jesus were here, I fully believe he would be OK with me questioning why He brought me into this broken world. Just as I can ask my earthly father questions, I can surely ask my Heavenly Father questions. This world has largely been a nightmare for me. Mental illness, divorce, addiction, dismissal from graduate school due to mental illness, premature friendship terminations without closure due to mental illness, strong suicidal thoughts, times of being incapable to care for my son, whom I believe is from God, etc.

 

Please consider that maybe others "have it worse" than you, and telling them they are being prideful by questioning God is like putting gas on the fire. 

 

 

Edited by Chris1234

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2 hours ago, Chris1234 said:

Thank you, Matthew and deade. (Matthew: I realize I am not the only one to experience the pain that I have experienced, but that alone does not make the 'suffering' or the pain any less powerful.).

 

Innerfire89, I don't wish to get into a heated or nasty debate with you. Again, the following is strongly worded but is not meant to hurt your feelings.

 

You did not address the specifics of my post. With all due respect, though I know you are not, you come across almost as an automaton or religious robot, incapable of having your own opinion and afraid to upset God with overly pious, obsequious fawning toward Him. These are real problems, real people, not "clowns" that we must deal with. If someone comes to you hungry, for example, Jesus would probably want you to give them food, not words about how they need to be less prideful. This world is real and requires practical solutions, not theological arguments. 

 

And by the way, referring to them as "clowns" contradicts your own strong belief in the body of Christ: you are seemingly insulting Him by referring to one of His creatures as a clown. 

 

I didn't mean that I would cross paths with the specific people that you ignore and later refer to as a clown. I meant you, along with the countless others that do as you do, make it more difficult for those like me who grow tired of others' innane, mean, selfish behavior. Just today, I was in the library sitting next to a young lady of about 18 years old who obviously "did not know better." I was trying to complete a job application (probably Job # 50 or 60 of my life, thanks to mental health issues). She was on 'speaker phone' with a friend who was using obscenities. Of course, the library staff were nowhere to be found, so I politely asked her to go outside with her conversation, which she did. I could have chosen to think "Boy, she sure is a clown," and then left. But how else will she learn the rules of the world (library, in this case). Obviously, her parents did not teach her. And next time she is in the library, she may be less likely to offend one of your children, or just children in general, etc. 

 

Please address these specifics: God throws us out into this broken world, knows we will sin, tells us we must beg for forgiveness when we sin (and we have no choice to not sin), and He owes us nothing? If anything, He should ask us for forgiveness. 

 

If I forced you into an environment in which you had no choice but to fail, would you be angry with me, or would you ask me to forgive you? If I forced into the boundaries of a football game for a lifetime and being a football player was the life you were destined to live, but I gave you no arms and no legs, how would you feel? And what if when you complained to me, I told you that you were being overly prideful and that you should ask me for forgiveness for your shortcomings. Would you ask me for forgiveness? I really don't think so. 

 

If God or Jesus were here, I fully believe he would be OK with me questioning why He brought me into this broken world. Just as I can ask my earthly father questions, I can surely ask my Heavenly Father questions. This world has largely been a nightmare for me. Mental illness, divorce, addiction, dismissal from graduate school due to mental illness, premature friendship terminations without closure due to mental illness, strong suicidal thoughts, times of being incapable to care for my son, whom I believe is from God, etc.

 

Please consider that maybe others "have it worse" than you, and telling them they are being prideful by questioning God is like putting gas on the fire. 

 

 

 

God has every right to do with us as He pleases. Not only does he put us into a broken world where we will inevitably sin, but He even chooses who will have salvation before the world was formed. Read Romans 9. Like I already said, but you ignored, you can't even beg for forgiveness without God enabling you to do so. See Romans 3:10-11, 1Corinthians 2:14, Genisis 3:6, John 3:19, and John 8:34.

 

What if you put me into such an environment?  You're not God! 

 

Instead of nit picking because I called people clowns, would you try to understand the point I'm making. The point is that you should take people like that with a grain of salt, their options are meaningless, because they are clowns. Jesus and the apostiles also insulted people because it's not always wrong to.

Believers are the body of Christ, not every person alive.

And was my description of them wrong? Are they not clowns?

 

The girl in the library is a totally different situation then what you first described. 

 

No one said you can't ask God questions.

 

How hard your life has been is irrelevant to who God is and where your place is as a man. It's is backwards and absurd for the created thing to think that he can judge God who is the authority of right and wrong, He is the judge.

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21 hours ago, Chris1234 said:

Thank you, Matthew and deade. (Matthew: I realize I am not the only one to experience the pain that I have experienced, but that alone does not make the 'suffering' or the pain any less powerful.).

 

Innerfire89, I don't wish to get into a heated or nasty debate with you. Again, the following is strongly worded but is not meant to hurt your feelings.

 

You did not address the specifics of my post. With all due respect, though I know you are not, you come across almost as an automaton or religious robot, incapable of having your own opinion and afraid to upset God with overly pious, obsequious fawning toward Him. These are real problems, real people, not "clowns" that we must deal with. If someone comes to you hungry, for example, Jesus would probably want you to give them food, not words about how they need to be less prideful. This world is real and requires practical solutions, not theological arguments. 

 

And by the way, referring to them as "clowns" contradicts your own strong belief in the body of Christ: you are seemingly insulting Him by referring to one of His creatures as a clown. 

 

I didn't mean that I would cross paths with the specific people that you ignore and later refer to as a clown. I meant you, along with the countless others that do as you do, make it more difficult for those like me who grow tired of others' innane, mean, selfish behavior. Just today, I was in the library sitting next to a young lady of about 18 years old who obviously "did not know better." I was trying to complete a job application (probably Job # 50 or 60 of my life, thanks to mental health issues). She was on 'speaker phone' with a friend who was using obscenities. Of course, the library staff were nowhere to be found, so I politely asked her to go outside with her conversation, which she did. I could have chosen to think "Boy, she sure is a clown," and then left. But how else will she learn the rules of the world (library, in this case). Obviously, her parents did not teach her. And next time she is in the library, she may be less likely to offend one of your children, or just children in general, etc. 

 

Please address these specifics: God throws us out into this broken world, knows we will sin, tells us we must beg for forgiveness when we sin (and we have no choice to not sin), and He owes us nothing? If anything, He should ask us for forgiveness. 

 

If I forced you into an environment in which you had no choice but to fail, would you be angry with me, or would you ask me to forgive you? If I forced into the boundaries of a football game for a lifetime and being a football player was the life you were destined to live, but I gave you no arms and no legs, how would you feel? And what if when you complained to me, I told you that you were being overly prideful and that you should ask me for forgiveness for your shortcomings. Would you ask me for forgiveness? I really don't think so. 

 

If God or Jesus were here, I fully believe he would be OK with me questioning why He brought me into this broken world. Just as I can ask my earthly father questions, I can surely ask my Heavenly Father questions. This world has largely been a nightmare for me. Mental illness, divorce, addiction, dismissal from graduate school due to mental illness, premature friendship terminations without closure due to mental illness, strong suicidal thoughts, times of being incapable to care for my son, whom I believe is from God, etc.

 

Please consider that maybe others "have it worse" than you, and telling them they are being prideful by questioning God is like putting gas on the fire. 

 

 

First welcome to the forum. I wish I could sit across from you and just talk and listen to your life story. However I hear a lot of disappointment and hurt in the words you write. The questioning you have for God as to why he brought you into this broken world might be worth exploring, but within your self first. I don't know how you look, or how disabled you are. You must look at these things in a honest way before you bring before the Father the questions as to why He brought you in this world with all its hurt and the nightmare you have experienced.

 

Knowing nothing about you, let me ask a few questions. Are you in a wheelchair, either full or part time?  Do you have full use of your arms, or legs, and spine?  Are you able to control your bladder of bowels?  Can you hear well or talk?  Do you have cancer?

 

I asked you the last questions so I can share with you I have some each of the things I listed above. I thank God for the life He has given me!  I ask God continually to keep me in the center of His will for me. Many decades ago I was mad at God, everything that was wrong in my life I blamed God for it.  My attitude was the problem. I asked God  "why" so many times, and He gave more discipline, so I would learn the true source of my problems was my attitude.

 

I was a young man just getting out of the NAVY in 1968, after 9 months is a Naval hospital. I came out having lost all I once had. I was still quite ill and I was forced by God to look at my life in a new way. I looked at Romans 1: 1-21 was my awaking, especially verse 21. I was not giving God any Glory or giving Him thanks, or living a thankful life. I came out of the Navy a very bitter, hurt, angry young man. To this day almost 50 years to this date something happened to me that began to wake me up. I was at the VA in Los Angles, CA. I was applying for VA benefits. The man taking my application said this to me. "Young man, I have been doing this for a long time, seen many men disabled like you are. But you are the most angry man I have ever met. Unless you change you life is going to be hell." God used that man in a such a meaningful way to begin to change my direction.

 

I began to read the Bible as never before, but when I read Romans the Holy Spirit convicted and broke my spirit. When I started thanking God for keeping me alive, and Glorifying Him things changed. Slowly my attitude was becoming anew. My life began to have meaning, even though I had feelings that God was working on, it took reading the WORD and allowing the Holy Spirit to work out those rough places. Some deep hurts took several years for me to be willing to give up.

 

Today I am a 73 year old gentleman who is deeply in love with the Father and Jesus Christ. Once in a great while some memory stirs up some issue I had hid even from my self, I face it, confess it, and give it before Jesus Christ to cover in His blood. I am far from perfect. Sometimes my disabilities are overwhelming, but God has promised I would not be given more than I am able to stand up with. I am experiencing just a smidgen of what the suffering Jesus went through for me.

 

Criss I don't know if anything I have shared will help, I pray something might open your eyes to the Loving God who cares for you. Scripture says Jesus Cares so much that the hairs on your head are numbered! Jesus died you, suffered the worst death a man can endure, Jesus carried our sins! That alone should show you, your nightmare of a life is just not so. Now wake up to Jesus Christ and no matter how bad things are Jesus is always with His true Followers. The real question is Criss is are you a Follower of Jesus Christ?  I will pray for you. 

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